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 Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer

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forgitaboutut
larryinseattle
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tankyuong
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PostSubject: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSat Aug 01, 2009 4:30 pm

should I ?
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wingnprayer
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSat Aug 01, 2009 5:32 pm

Why?
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tankyuong
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSat Aug 01, 2009 10:19 pm

wingnprayer wrote:
Why?
sometimes I like to start bike while on side stand.
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wingnprayer
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 02, 2009 4:28 am

Guess it depends on whether this outweighs the risk of coming down if you forget the stand. Personally I wouldn't.
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jdeereanton
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 02, 2009 5:27 am

IDisabling (for occasional personal convenience) any device or mechanism that the manufacturer placed on the bike as a "safety device" is probably not a prudent move.
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dspevack
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 02, 2009 12:32 pm

When I first bought the bike I had a stock seat and was on my tippy toes stopped at lights to balance the bike. I disabled the sidestand cutoff and added about 3/4 inch to the thickness of the foot of the stand.

Then when I would get to a stopligjht, I would drop the side stand and the
bike would lean little enought that I could put a little weight on the side stand and keep my feet on the Swing.

When the light changeed I'd simply shift my weight to the right a little so there was no pressure on the side stand, kick it up, and go.

In the beginning, I forgot a couple times but it never was enough to affect my balance, and I built up a habit quickly.

Dan
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 02, 2009 5:50 pm

I find the immobilizer to be an irritant. I often would like to leave the motor running for a few seconds while I drop a movie in the slot, or whatever.

It'll be a simple kill switch. You can short the wire ends together and that should do it.
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 02, 2009 9:02 pm

A lot of modern motorcycles have a starter interrupt switch on the side stand. If you've ever ridden off with the side stand down you may know why. I know of one fatal accident where the rider left a parking place, turned right and accelerated down the road then made a left turn which caused the sidestand to high side him into a guard rail. You might think the side stand would simply fold but often they lift the rear wheel off the ground and cause the bike to go down. The side stand safety switch is a good idea. One word of caution, if you sold a bike with that switch disabled you could be facing a serious law suit of the new owner was injured in a side stand accident.
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Aug 02, 2009 9:34 pm

exavid wrote:
A lot of modern motorcycles have a starter interrupt switch on the side stand. If you've ever ridden off with the side stand down you may know why. I know of one fatal accident where the rider left a parking place, turned right and accelerated down the road then made a left turn which caused the sidestand to high side him into a guard rail. You might think the side stand would simply fold but often they lift the rear wheel off the ground and cause the bike to go down. The side stand safety switch is a good idea. One word of caution, if you sold a bike with that switch disabled you could be facing a serious law suit of the new owner was injured in a side stand accident.

Good point on the liability issue.
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 03, 2009 9:28 pm

I went ahead and disabled mine yesterday. After riding old Harley's most of my life this is more to my liking.

I like it alot better this way.

DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 03, 2009 9:43 pm

It seems to me that the immobilizer switch could just as easily power up a warning light.
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 03, 2009 9:49 pm

That is a great idea and would be easy to do. When the stand is down is opens the switch and closes the circuit when up.
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MikeO
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 8:48 am

Working on the principle that Insurance Companies in the UK look for any excuse not to pay out in the event of an accident, I'd be extremely cautious about making such a modification, at least without informing them.
There have been cases where vehicle owners have 'invalidated' their insurance by doing such things as fitting after-market wheels (to cars), for example, without telling the company! Shocked
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 9:13 am

It sounds like your insurance company sucks. I was just wondering....does your insurance company require you to call them 24 hours before you take your scooter out for a ride so they can OK the ride. Just kidding.

Here in the US, the insurance companies work for us and if they get to fussy, we just let them go (fire them) and find another.
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 11:48 am

What is the best way to diable it so that if you want to enable later it would be and easy fix.
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MikeO
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 11:51 am

It sounds like your insurance company sucks

Dennis, unfortunately it's all-too-often the case; they seem only interested in grabbing the premiums and hanging on to them, come what may.
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Opalsboy
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 12:41 pm

Dennis... you feeling OK? Sounds like you may be a little edgy after the weekend. I know I am. You be careful with the kick stand thing. I know what the folks are saying. IT CAN be dangerous. Doesn't matter if the insurance pays or not if your brains are scattered all over the Tulsa freeway. I haven't done any deep scientific study or anything, but it seems like the stand on the Swing is lower than the stand was on the only other bike I ever owned back in the late 60s. At my age, I can appreciate the safety feature. I also can say that I would like to start the scoot up sometimes and let it idle while on the kick stand. All I am saying is just be careful. I would sure miss you... but if something happens ... I want your shop.
Gary
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 1:02 pm

Gary,

Beleave it or not I did have a 1984 Yamaha Verago that had a kick stand lock out and sold the bike shortly. I'm very used to having the kick stand old style. But some of you new riders need to maintain that lock out for now.

I already used it in traffic, at a stop light. I thought I had ran over someting and needed to check my front tire. So while stopped I put my kick stand down, got off the scooter while it was running and walked to the front to look at my tire. It looked good. I was on my way in a flash and never had to restart the scooter. It works for me.

What's really weird is when the spring on the kick stand brakes while your riding. This happened to me once on my 59 PanHead in 1992.
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Opalsboy
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 04, 2009 1:10 pm

Great! Just don't forget what I said about the shop!!!!
:thank you:
Gary
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KurtPerthWA
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 7:01 am

I will be disabling my stand switch shortly and as with my last scoot, wiring a a switch on the dash to turn it on and off as it is a real pain when going in and out of gates. I would also like to warm up the engine with the lower winter temperatures at the moment. The primary reason for the switch is to stop people revving the engine and the Swing taking off while no one is on it. If this is a problem just place a bit of 2inch plastic water pipe over the throttle assy and apply the handbrake for safety. Like Dennis, I know when I need something or not.
The one on my bike only cuts the engine if the stand is down and a gear is selected.
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thomphoto
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 10:46 am

KurtPerthWA wrote:
I will be disabling my stand switch shortly and as with my last scoot, wiring a a switch on the dash to turn it on and off as it is a real pain when going in and out of gates. I would also like to warm up the engine with the lower winter temperatures at the moment. The primary reason for the switch is to stop people revving the engine and the Swing taking off while no one is on it. If this is a problem just place a bit of 2inch plastic water pipe over the throttle assy and apply the handbrake for safety. Like Dennis, I know when I need something or not.
The one on my bike only cuts the engine if the stand is down and a gear is selected.


Can you post the instructions for disabling it. I always cuss when I stop at my mailbox and have to shut down the engine.

Wendell
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 1:06 pm

Hi All,

I've been getty a load of PM's On how to do this. One thing I need for you NOT to do is cut any wires. Here's a picture of the 1/4" blade type connector to use over the 2 pins (this connects the two pins). Make darn sure it fits tight on the pins and does not come off with a small amount of tugging. Then wrap it electrical tape to keep it safe and prevent contact with any ground points.

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Blade_10


Last edited by DennisB on Thu Aug 06, 2009 7:58 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 1:22 pm

Well Dumbo me I cut the wire on the kick stand side about 2 inches from the connector and taped the two wires together and attached it to securely to the frame with a tie. The other end from the kickstand side I tape it up but not the two wires together and secured it to the frame with tie wrap. I think it is really secure and it works. I couldn't fine a connector that fix right either two big or small and to me it would vibrate off and then engine would no run or start. I really didn't want to cut but it looked like to me it would hold better than a connector that didn' fit right. If you think this could hurt something I will order a new connector switch from Honda and put back on. Thanks
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 3:29 pm

That's it....I give up.
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 3:46 pm

Don't give up Dennis... I had a little trouble getting the front panel tabs loose, so, I borrowed my neighbors chain saw and cut a little below where they clip together... did I do wrong? If I did, I will trade in my Beautiful Silverwing for a Tonka truck I saw on the internet yesterday. It has sirens and it makes a noise when I push it...

I will take pictures when I get my new camera... until then, use your imagination.

Gary
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 4:51 pm

Don't give up on account of me. I only did what I thought would work. I am serious about if you think that It will cause trouble I would order the connector and replace it.
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 5:25 pm

This is one of those things (and there is NOT to many on the scooter mod list) that needs to changed back when you (some day) deside sell your scooter. Permently cutting any wiring on the scooters original harness is a BIG NO, NO and should be avoided at all cost. The way I explained it was easy, cheep, and quik to-do and un-do.

Now....If you ever need more information on how to get something done or more information on how to install other accessories just ask Gary (Opalsboy) but don't just start to shotgun through the project.

Taking care, your time, and being armed with a good sence of what needs to be done....These are the best tools and the first tools in any ones toolbox.
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 5:39 pm

I don't know which I like to smell better in the morning... shotgun powder or chainsaw oil... but reading and following the instructions always works for me.

Gary

Glad you didn't give up Dennis ...
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 6:30 pm

Dennis I appreciate the information that you took the time to send to me and apologize to you. I respect you opinion and would like to know that you wouldn't just write me off. I couldn't get a connector to fit and got over zealous and did what I though was acceptable to do. I know that anytime you disable a safety device you have to be careful. I would never sell my Swing with the switch disabled and not tell the potential buyer about it. In fact I am going to call my Honda Dealer an order a new switch and I will replace it way before I try to sell my Swing.

I respect your
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 6:50 pm

If you need the information out of the Honda Service manual, I can scan the pages and post them for you.

DennisB sunny
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 05, 2009 11:14 pm

The primary reason for the switch is to stop people revving the engine and the Swing taking off while no one is on it.

Actually the reason for the sidestand switch is to prevent someone from riding off with the stand down. There have been many people, and one fatality I know of, that have been injured by forgetting to retract the side stand. If you are inadvertently riding with the stand down and turn left it's very possible to have the rear wheel of the bike lifted off the pave ment as the bike tries to pole vault on the stand. Nearly guaranteed to drop the bike usually high siding it. Most modern motorcycles have the switch to prevent this type accident. On motorcycles the switch is set up so you can run the engine on the sidestand but not put it into gear. Normally it's in series with the neutral light, no neutral light, raise the stand and the engine quits. This doesn't work with a CVT since there's no neutral so it simply prevents the engine from being operated with the stand down.
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 02, 2011 11:17 am

I have only 16,000 miles on my S/W and the only problem I have had in the middle of no where, was the switch stooped working all together, when I pulled over to do some adjustments. At the time I had about 11,000 mil.

It was a humbling experience being stuck on the side of he freeway, with the hot wind blowing and my cell phone down to less than 20% but I had the switch replaced and still use it.
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larryinseattle
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Apr 01, 2012 3:53 pm

exavid wrote:
The primary reason for the switch is to stop people revving the engine and the Swing taking off while no one is on it.

Actually the reason for the sidestand switch is to prevent someone from riding off with the stand down. There have been many people, and one fatality I know of, that have been injured by forgetting to retract the side stand. If you are inadvertently riding with the stand down and turn left it's very possible to have the rear wheel of the bike lifted off the pave ment as the bike tries to pole vault on the stand. Nearly guaranteed to drop the bike usually high siding it. Most modern motorcycles have the switch to prevent this type accident. On motorcycles the switch is set up so you can run the engine on the sidestand but not put it into gear. Normally it's in series with the neutral light, no neutral light, raise the stand and the engine quits. This doesn't work with a CVT since there's no neutral so it simply prevents the engine from being operated with the stand down.

David,

I know you from being the top poster on the Goldwingfacts.com and I also know you sold your Silverwing, so I doubt that you continue to come to this forum, but I wanted to thank you for this post.

The OP asked "Should I" and this answers one of the questions in regards to this. The other is the residue of the mod. The bike gets sold to a first time bike owner and he gets hurt from the modification to his scooter that he is not even aware of.

If you are reading this forum and you are considering buying a Silverwing, ask the seller if they have modified this and or any other "good ideas." Honda is pretty good at engineering. Most bikes butchered up by owners end up being parts bikes as something happens to the bike and for whatever reason, it no longer will run. This really happens with Goldwings, which has a longer history than this model. Eventually, these will have the same problems when people screw up the wiring.

I am just saying..... watch out and give this some careful consideration before you make this mod and if you do, be prepared to justify it in a court of law when the new owner's family takes you to court for doing so.

This goes for any mod, including running a car tire, which I am currently doing on my Goldwing. bounce
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forgitaboutut
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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Apr 01, 2012 4:06 pm

Very good point and post Larry!
Something I hadn't really given any thought!
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Granny Rides
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PostSubject: Sidestand   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 08, 2014 6:09 pm

Hi guys
Is there anyway to "beef" up or replace the sidestand? It feels
wobbly compared to my ex-1500 Kaw. Guess what I did first thing when I got my 2009 S'wing..........hit the "clutch"...oops Shocked It does stop on a dime!
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dspevack
Silver Wing Guru
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dspevack


Number of posts : 2008
Age : 57
Location : Miami, FL
Points : 7494
Registration date : 2008-12-27

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSat Mar 08, 2014 8:07 pm

Beefing up the side stand....their are only two ways doing anything to the side stand would help.

1. Lengthening the stand.  This can be done by adding a piece of metal to the foot of it.
Any welder can do that.  The result is that it changes the lean angle.
When my bike was loaded with gear, it became top-heavy, overwhelming the stand.
A really strong wind can do that too.  I added 1/2 inch to mine.  Never had the problem again.

2. Widening the foot.  While a welder can do this also it must be done so that in the up position the stand can still be stowed.  What a lot of people do is they carry a small round metal object like a coffee can lid or an old tuna can.  Putting the stand on the metal object spreads the surface area of the stand. This is good for soft ground perhaps.

A new stand might have a thicker shaft, but a thicker shaft won't solve anything as no situation I've ever seen bends the current one.

The cheapest and easiest way to deal with it is to get in the habit of putting your bike on the center stand.

If that is a problem for you I have seen a silverwinger shorten the center stand.
A welder can do this too.
Then you end up with 4 points of contact. 2 wheels and two stand points.  
The down side to this is that you can no longer lift the bike high enough to do any maintenance.


Last edited by dspevack on Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:30 am; edited 1 time in total
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Granny Rides
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider
Granny Rides


Number of posts : 13
Age : 72
Location : Lake City, Florida
Points : 3225
Registration date : 2014-02-21

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: "Beefing up the side stand...."   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 09, 2014 7:56 am

Thank you so much for getting back to me. I have never owned a motorcycle with a center stand, so I thought that was only used for maintenance. I looked the technique up on You-Tube,
today I practice! Thanks again Smile 
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yammer
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider
yammer


Number of posts : 96
Age : 62
Location : Malta
Points : 3631
Registration date : 2013-05-04

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeSun Mar 09, 2014 11:41 am

I'm sure I've read somewhere that leaving the engine running while on the side stand can cause oil starvation on certain motorbikes, not sure if it would effect the Silver Wing though, but I still wouldn't leave it running for too long.
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john grinsel
Curmudgeon
john grinsel


Number of posts : 3240
Age : 83
Points : 8663
Registration date : 2009-08-18

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 10, 2014 7:39 pm

Defeat the sidestand switch=Why??

Standard sidestand is fine--no beef up necessary.


Never had bike with centerstand? How did you wash them??

Bike without centerstand sucks or is cruiser----however my TU250 does not have centerstand and bike is pain.

SilverWing is heavy (overweight) and use of centerstand requires

"skill not muscle to use it"
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Granny Rides
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider
Granny Rides


Number of posts : 13
Age : 72
Location : Lake City, Florida
Points : 3225
Registration date : 2014-02-21

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PostSubject: Centerstand   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 10, 2014 8:00 pm

"Never had bike with center stand? How did you wash them??

WOW....really? 800 Kawasaki...no centerstand....last bike was 1500 Kaw Vulcan Classic...no center stand.......and a whole bunch of others out there....but your kidding right?
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bigbird
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru



Number of posts : 2396
Location : Winnipeg
Points : 7199
Registration date : 2010-05-02

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 10, 2014 8:29 pm

john grinsel wrote:
Defeat the sidestand switch=Why??


So I can warm up the engine on a cold morning after rolling it out of the garage without having to put it up on the centre stand or sit on the bike while it's idling. Yes, I know it's dangerous.
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john grinsel
Curmudgeon
john grinsel


Number of posts : 3240
Age : 83
Points : 8663
Registration date : 2009-08-18

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PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 10, 2014 9:18 pm



For Bigbird----why bother to warm it up----modern oil ready to go right away----I am from cold climate in the beginning and ride all year regardless----WI=cold, Nasty TN just sucks, but it can be cold

For defender of Cruisers with no centerstands...Are they even motorcycles....they sure don't go around corners, are comfortable?.

Centerstand---bike up on it=easy to load if you ride everyday, haul stuff, great for the morning load up on trips.

Wash----centerstand=wheels can be turned, chain lubed-----I would never think of powerwash---can be hard on wheel bearings
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bigbird
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Silver Wing Guru



Number of posts : 2396
Location : Winnipeg
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Registration date : 2010-05-02

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 10, 2014 9:56 pm

john grinsel wrote:


For Bigbird----why bother to warm it up----modern oil ready to go right away----

The oil may be ready to go right away, but the cylinder walls, pistons, and rings aren't. I give them a chance to expand enough to reduce wear before driving. That way, when I get on and go, I can drive normally, not like a granny going to church.

But I don't have 200 kazillion rubber band miles under my belt, so what do I know?
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dspevack
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
dspevack


Number of posts : 2008
Age : 57
Location : Miami, FL
Points : 7494
Registration date : 2008-12-27

Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer Empty
PostSubject: Re: Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer   Disabling the Sidestand Engine Immobilizer I_icon_minitimeMon Mar 10, 2014 11:32 pm

We've gotten off topic and tempers are running high.


I'm temporarily locking this topic so all sides can cool down.

MOD DAN
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