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 Variator Pulley Nut

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Erdoc48
GHM-PM
paul@sweeneys.com.au
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paul@sweeneys.com.au
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PostSubject: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 22, 2023 10:32 pm

Hi All, I hope this post finds everyone well.

In the process of changing the drive belt for my 2004 S/wing, using a home made tool to lock the crank. When applying torque to the nut, using 17mm socket, 1/2 inch socket wrench with a breaker bar the locating bolts that fit into the pulley bent and chipped away two small pieces of the pulley.
The nut did not shift.
Has anyone else had this issue of the nut being so tight, and if so, how was it resolved?
I understand from the forum some folk are using an impact wrench, however, I would prefer not to invest the money in one, if it can be avoided.

Thanks, in anticipation.
Paul. Melbourne Australia.
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GHM-PM
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 23, 2023 7:11 am

I bought a variator tool to enable me to loosen the nut. Sadly, it didn't work well. Not sure whether the tool was poorly made or not but it did not help!

I ended up borrowing an impact wrench and that worked GREAT. I since got one used at a sale to have on hand and have used it several times.

Good luck.
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Erdoc48
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 23, 2023 8:16 am

Although you may not want to invest in one, it is a great tool to have (the impact gun)- my neighbor gave me his and I use it often- taking the wheel bolt off/ wheel nut on the rear/ variator, etc. comes off in seconds vs the old school way with a breaker bar.
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 23, 2023 11:51 am

It sounds like some ape has used an impact gun to tighten it up last time, so you'll need one to free it off. It's annoying to have to buy a tool for one job, but an impact gun is a good thing to have in the tool box.
And when you've changed the belt tighten the nut properly up using a torque wrench.
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Erdoc48
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 23, 2023 1:04 pm

Yup, I was remiss in that I didn’t say NEVER use an impact to tighten anything. Some people do but it’s really bad practice
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Loosemarbles
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 23, 2023 4:29 pm


It's wise to invest in a pulley holder although I had to file the lugs down to make them a good 'snug' fit.

If there is enough of the locating holes left then try a pulley holder as described above, you might get away with it. Failing that, an impact gun might shift it. It only requires 76lb/in for tightening.
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paul@sweeneys.com.au
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 28, 2023 4:14 am

Hi Folks, Many thanks for your guidance. Off to the tool shop for me. Annoyingly I had all the gear until downsizing 2 years back. still... Thank you again.
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zrx212
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 28, 2023 11:19 am

PSA, to clarify a few things, not the very short version  scratch  The front pulley uses a special UBS bolt (Uniform Bearing Stress, It's generally a term used for high tension bolts that need to be accurately torqued.), it is lubricated prior to installation and torqued to a fairly high value of 76 ft-lbs. or 103 Nm., but since is lubricated the actual torque can be approx. 25% higher, this is done to achieve proper clamping force and to deflect the friction lock by special slope/concave area in the bolt flange. When the bolt is properly installed and locks in place, the removal force will be far greater than the applied torque value.

 IOW, it's a lot more complex than we realize and installation is not easily/correctly accomplished with an impact wrench. But the impact wrench is excellent for removal and prevents damaging the fan pulley with holding tool, etc.

I've using this "Homemade" holder for years in many scooters, it's very adjustable and has a long handle/leverage, I usually setup like this picture to torque variators, but any holder you use must be properly supported in place when force is applied to prevent slipping off or breaking stuff.

Variator Pulley Nut Sw2211
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Loosemarbles
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeMon Aug 28, 2023 2:45 pm

Well, now I'm spooked....I've never lubricated that bolt! Shocked
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zrx212
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Variator Pulley Nut Empty
PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 29, 2023 7:04 am

Loosemarbles wrote:
Well, now I'm spooked....I've never lubricated that bolt! Shocked

Page/Section 10-9, can say the manual is "Crystal Clear" as it keep saying nut and/or bolt  scratch

Variator Pulley Nut Sw600f10
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Loosemarbles
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PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 29, 2023 3:36 pm


Nuts and Bolts I think it was our dearly missed friend Tim who advised not putting oil/grease on the drive pulley Bolt. I never put any kind of lubricant in any area of the drive face assembly. There are parts that look as though they ought to have some kind of lubricant, even dry carbon types.

The manual is clearly very confusing. I wonder if applying grease or oil to the 'rear' pulley/clutch assembly got lost in translation to the English FSM?






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zrx212
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Variator Pulley Nut Empty
PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeTue Aug 29, 2023 5:53 pm

Loosemarbles wrote:

Nuts and Bolts I think it was our dearly missed friend Tim who advised not putting oil/grease on the drive pulley Bolt. I never put any kind of lubricant in any area of the drive face assembly. There are parts that look as though they ought to have some kind of lubricant, even dry carbon types.

The manual is clearly very confusing. I wonder if applying grease or oil to the 'rear' pulley/clutch assembly got lost in translation to the English FSM?







 Well, the manual may be confusing on some word translations, but the requirement to lube this specific bolt with oil is fairly clear, there's even notes in the "Torque Values" section 1-11, 1-12 to
do so.

  Not sure about the "grease or oil" comment on the rear pulley/clutch assy., Shop manual section 10, tells you were to use grease and shows a grease gun symbol all thru the assembly process  scratch


Last edited by zrx212 on Wed Aug 30, 2023 6:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Loosemarbles
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Variator Pulley Nut Empty
PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 30, 2023 2:33 pm

Sorry about the confusion. I was referring to the clutch/pulley assembly nut rather than the assembly itself.
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zrx212
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Variator Pulley Nut Empty
PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 30, 2023 6:57 pm

Loosemarbles wrote:
Sorry about the confusion. I was referring to the clutch/pulley assembly nut rather than the assembly itself.


No problem, the rear pulley assembly "NUT" is mostly to locate it on the transmission shaft, there's more support on it from outer cover bearing and transmission shaft bearings, once the clutch engages/locks the rear pulley assembly is literally locked to transmission shaft.
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Mech 1 twa
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Variator Pulley Nut Empty
PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitimeWed Aug 30, 2023 9:49 pm

zrx212 wrote:
PSA, to clarify a few things, not the very short version  scratch  The front pulley uses a special UBS bolt (Uniform Bearing Stress, It's generally a term used for high tension bolts that need to be accurately torqued.), it is lubricated prior to installation and torqued to a fairly high value of 76 ft-lbs. or 103 Nm., but since is lubricated the actual torque can be approx. 25% higher, this is done to achieve proper clamping force and to deflect the friction lock by special slope/concave area in the bolt flange. When the bolt is properly installed and locks in place, the removal force will be far greater than the applied torque value.

 IOW, it's a lot more complex than we realize and installation is not easily/correctly accomplished with an impact wrench. But the impact wrench is excellent for removal and prevents damaging the fan pulley with holding tool, etc.

I've using this "Homemade" holder for years in many scooters, it's very adjustable and has a long handle/leverage, I usually setup like this picture to torque variators, but any holder you use must be properly supported in place when force is applied to prevent slipping off or breaking stuff.

Variator Pulley Nut Sw2211

This is a common thing for Honda cars lube crankshaft bolt when installing crankshaft pulley. I've done plenty of T-belts on many Honda engines same just a little oil on threads and washer. WD 40 just about anything to lube it don't soak it just a lite coating no drips and torque it. Avoid grease may increase actual torque values.
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Variator Pulley Nut Empty
PostSubject: Re: Variator Pulley Nut   Variator Pulley Nut I_icon_minitime

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