Brake pads

I often check ebay for some of my motorcycling needs. I was just looking at Silverwing brake pads. I found single pairs for just under $6 all the way up to $60 for a pair (single axle). I have heard the old saying "you get what you pay for" and I realize that brakes are supremely important and that our lives depend on them. I would appreciate your thoughts and advice. What do you use?

OEM have worked well for me.

Stick with OEM or a reputable brand bud, don't know about yourside of the pond but over here there have been instances of clones that delaminate.

Thank both of you for your advice..........after all Honda built the bike so from your educated advice I will stick with Honda brake pads. You are appreciated.

Just my input but i don't think that i have ever have purchased a genuine part for any of my bikes or scooters that i can remember other than a drive belt for the s/wing. I have had parts from Ebay, local independent retailers. M&P and Wemoto and brake pads from EBC direct, oil filters from whoever usually looking on price and quick delivery or in stock. wheel bearings and seals from a local bearing company and i have never had a problem with anything fail or a brake pad delaminate.
Generally i refuse to pay dealer OEM prices but that's the individuals choice. I am not by any chance tight fisted and if an replacement part is not available i would not hesitate to purchase from a main dealer but up to now i have not had any problems with anything purchased over the years. Pud.

vmaximus wrote:

brake pads from EBC direct,

That's the trick bud, buying reputable brand from the maker, it was clone EBC's from some eblag sites that were failing

The only other comment is when deviating from stock OEM is to make sure the pad compound (hardness ) matches the OEM. I've used EBC on my G'Wings with no problems but some haven't, rotor hardness and pad hardness combinations are important.

I found that Honda pads are the way to go, even though the Honda dealers prefer to sell EBC, and will order those if you do not specifically request OEM. I imagine they have much better margin on the EBC, since the price they charge is about the same by a only a few dollars.

One thing to point out is the OEM pads come with the phenolic and SS insulators to help keep the caliper cooler. The EBC do not.
Also the EBC pads make more noise than OEM.

Well Mr sidewinder pilot, not to make myself look daft but what is phenolic and ss insulator, It sounds like they should be on the Enterprise (beam me up Scotty) but joking aside whichever brand I have used in the past I've noticed very little to no difference. As regards being noisier with a full face helmet and ear plugs the noise increase is probably negligible, but as I've said before it's your choice I personally don't wish to buy something just because it says Honda, Yamaha etc on the package . Pud.

I have used Goldfren brake pads in the past and they seemed to work okay, but I fitted, on the front, pads called ALPHA organic. Whatever you do, do NOT buy these pads. My original Honda pads lasted 27,000mls. After 2,000 mls the pads were worn out and beginning to rub on the disc. I am presently running on PYRAMID pads and all seems well.

Also the EBC pads make more noise than OEM. <<>> Others have complained also, try this with the EBC, used a medium flat bastard file and slightly chamber the EDGES, just enough to knock the square edge back a bit,, it seems for what ever reason to help cut the noise.

Clarification;

Phenolic is a type of material made of glass reinforced epoxy
SS is how lazy typists indicate Stainless Steel in the context of material descriptions
(not to be confused with Super Sport)

The insulator is probably not actual phenolic, but that's an easier way to describe it because it resembles that material somewhat. I assume the Honda material is much more heat resistant due to being in contact with the metal back of the pad.

The stainless steel piece attaches the insulator to the pad and distributes the force from the caliper.

oldwingguy wrote:

The only other comment is when deviating from stock OEM is to make sure the pad compound  (hardness ) matches the OEM../snipped/.. rotor hardness and pad hardness combinations are important.

Good point, well made bud :Happy Holiday:

Something I've noted over the years is disc rotor wear is much higher with aftermarket hard compound and sintered pads, oem pads will keep actual disc wear to the minimum. Pads are cheaper than buying disc rotors.

GeoffM wrote:

Something I've noted over the years is disc rotor wear is much higher with aftermarket hard compound and sintered pads, oem pads will keep actual disc wear to the minimum. Pads are cheaper than buying disc rotors.

Very important point Geoff. Thank you.

I managed to "wear out" a front rotor on my '03 S/Wing due to EBC pads. Because, as Sidewinder Pilot referred to, above, that's what the guy at the dealer's parts counter sold me. Now I keep a spare set of OEM pads in the shed.

Tim

I have had good service with both OEM and EBC brake pads. One thing to consider is sintered (metallic) vs. organic pads. Sintered pads are excellent and give a bit more braking effort compared to the pressure needed on the brake lever, great for high performance use. On the down side is more wear occurs to the brake disk and with organic. Organic pads work well for normal use and are easier on the brake rotors. I prefer the organics, been using EBC organics for several years on my previous Goldwings. The weight of the Goldwing, aproaching half a ton with one rider puts their brakes to the test. I found organic EBCs or OEM (also organic) worked well for my riding style. If I wanted to push my bike to its limits on every curve like a lot of sport bike riders then I'd go with sintered pads, but I ride conservatively (most of the time) so use organics which provide good braking, reasonable life and provide longer rotor life.

Some aftermarket pads are JUST slightly smaller on pad surface this wears rotor at edges and leaves a ridge on rotors . Compound of pads could also be the problem but OEM seem to last a long time without damaging rotors.

One thing a lot of folks don't think about when comparing brake life is riding habits. Some come up to stops and brake harder than those who downshift and slow before coming to that stop. Using both brakes to stop when stopping in a straight line such as at an intersection helps with brake life. Obviously one shouldn't hit the front brakes hard in a curve or on dicey road surfaces but it's not a good idea to under-use the front brakes either. ABS brakes also help with brake life because used properly they will even out the brake use automatically if used properly. Proper use of ABS requires one to apply both brakes firmly and let the ABS keep the bike stopping in a straight line. It takes awhile for old geezers like me to trust the ABS but after over 100,000 miles on ABS bikes I wouldn't own another bike without ABS.

Well, not to be pedantic, but someone had to say it right? Downshift a scooter?

Many of us have other bikes with manual transmissions. Info is all good. Larger bikes with much power down shifting is a great way to slow down without using brakes at all.

Yes, I was referring to downshifting on motorcycles. That's the red one beside the GT in my avatar. Replace the reference to downshifting to reducing speed earlier at an expected stop. Some slow down quite a bit prior to stopping, some decelerate rapidly closer to the stop. It does save brakes to lose some of the kinetic energy to engine drag over making the conversion of energy to heat in one hard braking stop. Using the front brakes as well as the rear on straight stops will result in longer break pad life.

exavid wrote:

Yes, I was referring to downshifting on motorcycles. That's the red one beside the GT in my avatar. Replace the reference to downshifting to reducing speed earlier at an expected stop. Some slow down quite a bit prior to stopping, some decelerate rapidly closer to the stop. It does save brakes to lose some of the kinetic energy to engine drag over making the conversion of energy to heat in one hard braking stop. Using the front brakes as well as the rear on straight stops will result in longer break pad life.

I like to use the engine braking of my Swing. I use it all the time. I saw a video from McRider and he states when using the front brakes, apply pressure gradually. This allows the weight of the bike to transfer to the front tyre causing the treads to spread and make better contact with the road surface. He suggested practicing this regularly so that it will come naturally when in an emergency situation. All this while using the rear brakes. In our situation, using the linked brakes.

Several months ago while looking on fleaBay for a set of cheap parking brake pads, I came across a full set of SixtySix brand pads (F, R & P) for the rediculous price of 12 bucks, so I bought them for the parking pads and put the rest in my underseat toolbag as a "just in case I wasn't paying attention to the wear" set.

As normal practice I always use the Honda hi temp sintered pads (VFR800?)
Or, sometimes the oem organic ones, the point is I had to actually use the backup set a few weeks ago, well, because I didn't pay attention to my pad thickness.
They are still on the bike and for around town are fine. I now have the good ones waiting under the seat, but since I'm currently not riding hard & in hills, I'm just running the cheap ones.

On first application I get enough braking action to be on the edge of lockup, but with successive high speed stops I get an uncomfortable amount of fade and padstink, but around town this is not a factor.
If I go on a trip where I would see stop and go, or more aggressive riding I will change them first, but 12 bucks instead of 60 for a front/rear set is worth the more frequent labor.

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I'd argue that waiting to change the pads for a longer ride might be hazardous to one's health. Riding around town one is probably more likely to have an accident than out on the road. Especially since local riding tends to breed complacency. Saving few bucks on brake pads isn't the best way to hang onto a few bucks (IMO). On bikes I've always tended to replace pads when they reach half original thickness. I know they could have gone farther but I want them to work when I REALLY NEED them. Ditto with tires, I don't like to run tires until the tread is worn nearly through. At about 25% remaining tread I get rid of the front tire, I might run the rear one down a bit more but usually change it around 25%. A rear tire failure isn't quite as dangerous as losing a front one.

Normally, I would not buy anything but Honda pads, because they last longer and work better than EBC etc. But I was looking for parking pads, which would be fine no matter how much the braking sucked, it's only to keep it from rolling.

I was not intending to run the cheap organics, but I had them in my bag when I heard premature grinding, at less than 10k miles, from my organic Honda pads while on a trip, and they work nearly as good as the oem.

The front tire will be due in a few thousand miles and my disk is worn out from all of the sintered pads over the past 60k mi, so new oem disk and pads for me!

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I'm at 41000 miles and still have the original brakes. I did order some new rear pads from Honda (same as original) last Fall. The plan is to put them on when I remove the rear wheel in the next few weeks to replace the tire.

The original pads seem to stop me very well and have lasted a long enough time. I can't remember the exact price, but they were not expensive (although not $6 either!).

I just bought a set of front organic semi-metallic brake pads from "Sixty" for about $12.00 delivered. I looked at Honda front organics for $36.00 plus shipping ; give me a break. The reason I'm installing the new pads is because I bought the 2005 with leaking left fork seals and pads were wet with oil. I cleaned front pads with brake cleaner and stopped fork seal leakage. The bike stops pretty good but it won't do a front wheel stand like my previous non-abs Swing.I'll let you folks know how they work out. Sixty claims pads are easy on rotors. We'll see.

I will only use EBC if I'm stuck, I prefer to buy Honda OEM ones. I find the EBC ones have a smaller pad area, which does improve the bite a little bit, but at cost of wear of the pad and disc.
I have the view that Honda would have done the research into what the bike needed to stop safely, and last through the warranty period too, no matter where in the world the bike is. I've never managed to "fade" genuine pads, and I have tried.

The ones on the front of the 'Wing appear to be Honda Blackbird...

I guess they would need to be that hard as you are stopping a bike that isn't that much lighter, using one disc instead of two, and that one disc is the same size as a Honda Blackbird rear disc. Which is sobering when you think about it. I know the 'Wing doesn't quite have the same level of performance, but the brakes still need to be able to do the job.

A few of the later bikes (my 2015 VFR for instance) use Phenolic pistons in the calipers now. They don't rot, but they are nowhere near as strong either.

Update on new front pads. Five days ago the new Sixty organic semi-metallic were installed and found the pads were binding to where the front wheel wouldn't spin freely and causing the disc to get pretty hot after a couple hundred yards of riding. Removed the caliper and cleaned . Same problem. Removed the caliper again and cleaned the cylinders by squeezing the front and rear brake lever carefully to expose the cylinders enough for a good cleaning and adding a little brake fluid to lubricate for easier movement and worked back and forth a few times. The front wheel still has a drag after brake release. Rode for a mile and found the disc hot but not blistering hot. The retainer and pad pin were lubed and pad spring cleaned. What next??

SWAG, pads to thick?

oldwingguy, When I pushed back the cylinders to replace pads there was still more then enough room to insert new pads. I'm thinking maybe one or more cylinders is hanging up slightly even after cleaning and lubing with brake fluid.

Use a brake cylinder honer to clean the piston walls. Make sure you use brake fluid as a lubricant.

AldusFran wrote:

oldwingguy, When I pushed back the cylinders to replace pads there was still more then enough room to insert new pads. I'm thinking maybe one or more cylinders is hanging up slightly even after cleaning and lubing with brake fluid.

Sounds like pistons are sticking. Brake fluid likes to attract moisture causing the pistons to rust. Once you pushed them back the rust can bind inside the caliper bore. Lubing pistons won't help because rust is behind the piston O-ring.

Rebuild might be needed new pistons, seals and boots. Hone is used to clean the bore of calipers. Honda recommends brake fluid flush every two years. New to you bike who knows the history?

Could be the pads are sticking in the sliders too. I presume the cailper can slide on the pins?

rare the pistons stick that hard, but not so rare that the caliper itself cannot slide on the carrier bracket.