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 Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!

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cotetoi
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert


Number of posts : 754
Location : New Brunswick, Canada
Points : 3761
Registration date : 2013-06-27

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 05, 2013 2:19 pm

As you guys know, I just got my Swing and have been riding it quite a bit. It had 4900 km on it and now has 8100 Embarassed . Went for a 600 km ride yesterday with some buddies of mine. Felt a bit ashamed of myself that I had not changed the oil yet. Made myself a note to change it ASAP today, and dithered until 200 pm. Got everything ( 6 pt 24 mm in hand) together and went at it. Now, I am probably the least mechanically astute guy of the whole forum. I had to really come on to the tapit? because it was on there way tighter than I expected.
Now the PO had told me that a Honda dealer mechanic had been servicing the bike as needed, hopefully at least yearly. It did not have any miles at all for an 8 yr old bike. Keeping that in mind, I figured that this mechanic had used a power tool to put the tapit back on and there! it was on for life. So, I used more and more force until I felt a give, and then some more. All of a sudden, the oil comes gushing out before I even unscrewed the tapit out. I found that strange because my ACE never did that. I thought new bike, new ways.
Next I tackled the oil filter and lo and behold: the wrench was hardly on, and the filter was rolling out ! Thank goodness for that. I was anticipating a wrestling match with the filter. So, all the oil drains out and I unscrewed the tapit, and right away I saw that I needed a new o-ring. It was on there so squashed It would take a pick to get it out. No way of re-using that one. And then, I fished out the metal screen, looked okay except a bit warped around the opening but still good.
A close look at the tapit: A crack that went all the way around the rim and only a 2 mm bit of metal holding it together !!!! Talk about a close call, another tug on that thing and the threads would have stayed locked inside, and knowing myself; at that point I would be calling the tow truck. But thankfully I caught it just in time.
Now she's laid up until I get the parts from the local dealer, and it is Saturday: thank goodness no one has come to give me $10,000.00 for my ACE. I know I would not be able to turn down an offer like that !!! So, I can still ride, that's a good thing.
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surlybiker58
Touring Scooter Rider
Touring Scooter Rider
surlybiker58

Number of posts : 350
Location : Elkton , Maryland
Points : 3805
Registration date : 2011-12-11

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PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 05, 2013 4:46 pm

For what it's worth, Honda recommends you change the o ring each time you change the oil
I found that I have to order several at a time, since my local dealer doesn't keep many in stock
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model28a
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
model28a

Number of posts : 2090
Age : 68
Location : St.Pete.FL.
Points : 6269
Registration date : 2010-02-03

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PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 05, 2013 6:04 pm

Sorry to hear you had such a problem with what should have been a simple oil change. When you put the oil filter on make sure you wet the gasket with a little oil with your finger. Then screw it on by hand until it just bottoms out, then turn it no more than a ¼-½ turn by hand. When you put the new plug and O-ring back in just don't need to put in on too tight, that's what the O-ring is for it's not under much if any pressure.
I know Honda recommends you change the O-ring each time you change the oil. But I have put over 47,000 miles on my 08 Silverwing and I still have the original O-ring on. You will not need to replace the O-ring  if you don't over tighten it. After you are done wipe the plate under the engine or you will think you have a leak and it will probably be just dripping from the plate.
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cotetoi
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert


Number of posts : 754
Location : New Brunswick, Canada
Points : 3761
Registration date : 2013-06-27

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PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 05, 2013 7:00 pm

The PO was a GoldWing rider for years until he became sick and couldn't ride anymore. I suspect he would have done his own service if he had the health. He let the mechanic do the work and this guy did not take enough care to do the work like an owner. The oil filter was so easy to unscrew that I thought surely the oil would have leaked, but it didn't. On the other hand, the tapit was on there as if for life. I am glad I caught it just in time. Any more riding and the tapit could have blown out or fused to the block because the threads were weakened from overtightening. Close call.
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SilverwingInIdaho
Maxi-Scooter Rider
Maxi-Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 155
Points : 3747
Registration date : 2011-08-23

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 1:00 am

surlybiker58 wrote:
For what it's worth, Honda recommends you change the o ring each time you change the oil
I found that I have to order several at a time, since my local dealer doesn't keep many in stock

Had no idea, just did my second oil change. What is the part called and can you recommend a good place to order?

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exavid
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 2658
Age : 78
Location : Medford, Oregon
Points : 7102
Registration date : 2009-07-17

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PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 1:10 am

Partzilla, Motogrid or Honda Direct Line are all good sources for OEM parts.
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NWSSC
Silver Wing Rider
Silver Wing Rider
NWSSC

Number of posts : 418
Age : 83
Location : Mt Prospect IL 30 miles west of Chicago
Points : 4553
Registration date : 2010-03-03

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Today at 1:00 am   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 1:20 am

It sounds a little strange that the oil came out that fast with out
removing the drain plug completely .Some times the plug will brake
off and leave some of the threads in the engine block. I would think that the oil would not come out that fast unless some of the threads broke off and are still in the engine block.If this is the case it is not a big deal,the threads usually can be removed by turning them out.
This plug is a carry over from other Honda engines (valve adjustment access )and is not a tapered fit but just seals on the 'O' ring. Howard
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SilverwingInIdaho
Maxi-Scooter Rider
Maxi-Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 155
Points : 3747
Registration date : 2011-08-23

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 2:40 am

The O ring at least looked to be in really good condition when I looked at it. Can I assume I will see leaking if it's bad?
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tinman
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 1299
Age : 72
Location : Matheson, Ontario, Canada
Points : 4835
Registration date : 2011-11-29

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 6:08 am

76 k kl and at least 8 oil change and same O ring, just put some teflon gas pipe sealer on the flange. No need to replace O ring and no leaks,replace oil filter every 20 k kl , Swing ( bullet proof)runs like new.
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Cosmic_Jumper
Site Admin
Cosmic_Jumper

Number of posts : 3742
Age : 78
Location : damn near Philadelphia, PA
Points : 8686
Registration date : 2009-06-12

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 9:27 am

tinman wrote:
76 k kl and at least 8 oil change and same O ring, just put some teflon gas pipe sealer on the flange. No need to replace O ring and no leaks,replace oil filter every 20 k kl , Swing ( bullet proof)runs like new.

Liquid Teflon or Teflon tape?
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tinman
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 1299
Age : 72
Location : Matheson, Ontario, Canada
Points : 4835
Registration date : 2011-11-29

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 4:53 pm

Liquid Teflon gas approved is the best in the 40 years as a natural gas piping heating contractor  ( retired)
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oldgwingguy
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 247
Location : Hocking Hills
Points : 2555
Registration date : 2015-02-08

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 8:50 pm

Has anyone ever sought out and bought a different oil plug rather than the tappet cover they use?
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NWSSC
Silver Wing Rider
Silver Wing Rider
NWSSC

Number of posts : 418
Age : 83
Location : Mt Prospect IL 30 miles west of Chicago
Points : 4553
Registration date : 2010-03-03

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!    Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2015 11:31 pm

You could not use a drain plug that seals by tapered threads. The plug is a carry over from other Honda engines and the engine block is not machined for a tapered fit.The plug seals only by the pressure
created on the 'O' ring on the drain plug when it is tightened down.
It may have been Honda's theory that you could not strip the threads in the block with this design. You will brake off the threads if you are to zealous. I've had to remove the threads for a few friends. Howard
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oldgwingguy
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 247
Location : Hocking Hills
Points : 2555
Registration date : 2015-02-08

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2015 6:17 am

Thank you, I remember those covers starting back in 73 on my 1st Honda. That must be a fun job getting the leftovers out. As for being over zealous I clearly remember my worst problems with that came from the " pro " shops Honda being the worst.
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AldusFran
Maxi-Scooter Rider
Maxi-Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 148
Age : 74
Location : Tucson,AZ
Points : 2316
Registration date : 2015-06-13

Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! Empty
PostSubject: Re: Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some!   Oil change surprise. Well, maybe not to some! I_icon_minitimeFri Jun 26, 2015 5:35 pm

You want to hear a scary one? Next to my last bike was a Kawasaki Voyager. Went to owner and he said bike was serviced by a local mechanic and everything is good. So I suggested that he trailer it to my place (60 miles) he says OK. Thank god. When I got it home I wanted to check the oil so I drained the bike. The bike had 2 1/4 quarts more than recommended. Had I tried to drive it home the engine would have blown. Do not take anybody's word for it that everything is ok dorky.
Another ting when changing oil and filter ; drain and after fifteen twenty minutes start the bike and run for about 3-4 seconds. You'll be surprised how much dirty oil is still in oil pump. When you check oil again after running a couple minutes the oil will look cleaner.
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