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 silverwing misfire

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Freezeagle
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 8
Age : 70
Location : Newton Abbot UK
Points : 187
Registration date : 2020-06-08

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PostSubject: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 08, 2020 10:01 am

Hi,first post (new boy),my 2011 silverwing has just started to run rough on its 1st morning start,black smoke from exaust and then blue smoke when you manage to pull away,once warmed up all is ok,have just put new plugs in but no differance,have ordered an air filter,have had bike for 4 yrs no problems,please anyone help.
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JamieB
Maxi-Scooter Rider
Maxi-Scooter Rider
JamieB

Number of posts : 109
Age : 43
Location : North West UK
Points : 3783
Registration date : 2011-02-01

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 08, 2020 1:40 pm

Hi,

Introduce yourself to the forum first then jump in with a question, you will get more replies.
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Terry Smith
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider
Terry Smith

Number of posts : 210
Age : 56
Location : Auckland, New Zealand
Points : 498
Registration date : 2020-03-11

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 08, 2020 7:57 pm

Black smoke on start up is a sign of over rich fuelling. I doubt the air filter would be blocked enough to cause that but still work ok when hot, I'm thinking that could be an ignition fault like a plug wire breaking down, or fuelling maybe the fuel pressure regulator or a stuck injector.
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Freezeagle
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 8
Age : 70
Location : Newton Abbot UK
Points : 187
Registration date : 2020-06-08

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 09, 2020 4:26 am

thanks to Terry in Auckland, i forgot on introduction to say mileage is 33000 on this swing.
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Freezeagle
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 8
Age : 70
Location : Newton Abbot UK
Points : 187
Registration date : 2020-06-08

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 09, 2020 4:29 am

engine not easy to access so maybe an exspensive visit to honda dealer.
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Meldrew
Visiting Curmudgeon
Meldrew

Number of posts : 3565
Location : York, North Yorkshire, England UK
Points : 7328
Registration date : 2010-11-16

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 09, 2020 4:50 am

What's the problem there, Honda dealers and their trained staff have to make a living too and they've lost a least of couple of their peak trading months due to the lockdown. I had an email from Honda recently saying that they're gradually opening their motorcycle dealerships up again.







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Freezeagle
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 8
Age : 70
Location : Newton Abbot UK
Points : 187
Registration date : 2020-06-08

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 09, 2020 5:16 am

thanks Meldrew,have just phoned dealer and ours is also now open but very busy,am booked in for end of the month !
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The Bern
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
The Bern

Number of posts : 899
Location : Telford, UK
Points : 3180
Registration date : 2014-11-20

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 09, 2020 5:34 am

As Meldrew (hi bud  Smile ) implied, sometimes a dealer trained mechanic is the best option, especially as you've made no mention of your mechanical abilities/available toolkit.

Anyhoo I like a 'guessing game'

Hmmm, black smoke is overfuelling, blue smoke is burning oil, did it start having blue smoke before the black smoke started ? if so ....

My best guess from the information given is that you have been burning oil, the soot from that has settled on the lamda sensor, which is now sending the wrong air/fuel ratio information to the ECU causing the overfuelling & susiquent erratic idle
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Donie
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 74
Location : Ireland
Points : 2888
Registration date : 2013-04-07

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeMon Jun 22, 2020 5:28 pm

OK, I'm alright with the theory that the over-rich fuel mixture is fogging the lambda sensor, and keeping that problem in perpetuation, but I don't understand how the blue smoke problem goes away when the engine reaches normal temperature.

Burning oil is associated with either broken/worn piston rings, or bad valve seals, and I wouldn't expect either one at 33,000 miles.

Anyone have any other theories to throw into the mix?
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Freezeagle
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 8
Age : 70
Location : Newton Abbot UK
Points : 187
Registration date : 2020-06-08

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 1:56 am

many thanks for your input Terry,Meldrew,The Bern,Donie,well customer misuse i had refuelled with stored fuel in a can which had DIESEL!! in it,costly mistake but all good now thanks to local Honda dealer,have a good day everyone.
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The Bern
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
The Bern

Number of posts : 899
Location : Telford, UK
Points : 3180
Registration date : 2014-11-20

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 5:28 am

Ahh bugger, but easily done bud, well done on getting it sorted, espescially as you can now get out & enjoy the Devon countryside again cheers
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Donie
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 74
Location : Ireland
Points : 2888
Registration date : 2013-04-07

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 8:16 am


Did it myself about a month ago with kero into a walk-behind lawnmower...……………...but the compression wasn't up for burning it.

Some might say "How could you possibly...…"

Simplest thing in the world...…..just a pity it took a stealer to sort it out £££££$$$$$$$
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Cosmic_Jumper
Site Admin
Cosmic_Jumper

Number of posts : 3588
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Location : damn near Philadelphia, PA
Points : 8339
Registration date : 2009-06-12

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 10:33 am

I wonder what the dealer specifically did to remedy the problem? 

If the OP identified diesel in the fuel tank in advance of taking it to the dealer, was it a just a matter of emptying the contaminated fuel, then refilling with fresh fuel and a bottle of fuel system cleaner? Or was there something more done?

Somebody here is sure to make the same diesel fuel mistake in the future. It would be nice to be able to coach him thru the solution.

Tim
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Loosemarbles
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Loosemarbles

Number of posts : 538
Location : South East England
Points : 2115
Registration date : 2016-10-01

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 2:40 pm

Reminds me of some stupid pillock who put anti-freeze into his oil filler hole!..."but the containers looked exactly the same your honour" Rolling Eyes
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Meldrew
Visiting Curmudgeon
Meldrew

Number of posts : 3565
Location : York, North Yorkshire, England UK
Points : 7328
Registration date : 2010-11-16

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 3:06 pm

I always think of the dealers tale many years ago in the old Motorcycle Weekly. A young lad with a moped had gone into their Spares Department asking for a bottle of Indicator Fluid so he could top his up.

Of course no one knew what this spotty Herbert was on about, so the spares guy went outside with the lad asked to be shown the problem. The lads scuffed and scraped moped had a couple of cracked and bent indicators where half an inch of rainwater had leaked in.

Having read up about oil levels, the pustule challenged lad thought the clear liquid was something other than rainwater.
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Mech 1 twa
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Mech 1 twa

Number of posts : 970
Location : Allentown PA.
Points : 2838
Registration date : 2016-01-02

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 4:58 pm

Diesel. The best way to tell is the smell from exhaust. Smoke also.
SW has a return fuel system so it was mixing very well. A little it will still run, a lot and you wouldn't make it far . Drain the tank and most will be gone might run a rough little till it's all used up only a few ounces in fuel filter lines.

New Jersey residents can't pump their own fuel LAW and have seen a few who did it in PA. and filled with Diesel. Left the gas station about a block stalled out. DUH pumps are clearly marked.



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Terry Smith
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider
Terry Smith

Number of posts : 210
Age : 56
Location : Auckland, New Zealand
Points : 498
Registration date : 2020-03-11

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 23, 2020 5:09 pm

Good on you for posting up the answer to this one Freezeagle! There's not too many bikes that like the taste of diesel, maybe only the militarised version of the Kawasaki KLR650 which can run on all military-spec fuels including diesel and JP-8 jet fuel...
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Freezeagle
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 8
Age : 70
Location : Newton Abbot UK
Points : 187
Registration date : 2020-06-08

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PostSubject: Diesel in fuel tank    silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 24, 2020 11:13 am

well Cosmic-Jumper, the dealer found the problem otherwise i would have sorted it myself. They drained tank and flushed thro fuel filter lines and fuel pump, injectors etc., fitted new spark plugs , recharged the battery. 2:75 hrs work and runs like a dream. I think i will give it an oil change now, cheers for everyone input.
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Easyrider
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Easyrider

Number of posts : 947
Age : 70
Location : HI
Points : 2830
Registration date : 2015-12-18

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PostSubject: Re: silverwing misfire   silverwing misfire I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 24, 2020 9:48 pm

I almost made that mistake at a fuel station in Idaho. Went looking for E-free gas. The station that had E-free gas also sells diesel and that pump had combination hoses. One for gasoline and one for diesel. Not paying attention I picked the diesel hose and pressed the trigger. Only a few drops went into the tank before I realized what I had done. In Hawaii diesel pumps are separate from gasoline pumps. Now I am back on Oahu in self-quarantine for 14 days.
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