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Mrmoz
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 32
Location : Uk
Points : 813
Registration date : 2018-08-23

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PostSubject: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeThu Feb 20, 2020 2:11 pm

Hi guys it's been a grim winter in the UK and just never stops raining at the moment. Over the last few weeks I've been commuting on the wing and noticed that the front brake feels very vague and hard to pull the lever in' it dose work but you have to pull hard. However the back brake lever is great and also dips the front end so I know the pistons aren't seized. I've never worked on a linked system before and not sure why the front lever doesn't bring the front brakes on like the back brake lever dose I hope I've made sense.. Any advice always greatly appreciated.
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Cosmic_Jumper
Site Admin
Cosmic_Jumper

Number of posts : 3501
Age : 77
Location : damn near Philadelphia, PA
Points : 8177
Registration date : 2009-06-12

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeThu Feb 20, 2020 5:47 pm

Sounds to me as if you’ll need to refurbish the front caliper pistons & seals. Could be that those infamous UK road treatment chemicals have caused corrosion in that area.


Front brake issues  02abf110
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Meldrew
Visiting Curmudgeon
Meldrew

Number of posts : 3516
Location : York, North Yorkshire, England UK
Points : 7216
Registration date : 2010-11-16

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeThu Feb 20, 2020 6:45 pm

We don't have any infamous UK road treatment chemicals. They use rock salt from mines, crushed and mixed with anti-caking agent, and always have done as far as I know. Our counties Highway Departments order it in before Winter and stockpile in their depots. When needed it's mixed with sand and spread onto roads in order of priority by the gritters.

In a bad winter they’ll use a lot and may have to order in more depending on their budget constraints. So far this winter up here in York we've had a few frosty mornings, but no snow or ice. They only places I've see any road salt spread about is on a couple of supermarket and hospital car parks.

Unlike rain, we've had plenty of that nationwide and there's serious flooding in some areas, so there's no need for them to be flinging road salt about. Councils however are using vast amounts of sand in sandbags for flood defence.
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Cosmic_Jumper
Site Admin
Cosmic_Jumper

Number of posts : 3501
Age : 77
Location : damn near Philadelphia, PA
Points : 8177
Registration date : 2009-06-12

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeThu Feb 20, 2020 7:07 pm

Thanks for the climate data, Meldrew. 

My “infamous UK road treatment chemicals” comment was prompted by the several posts we’ve had over the years regarding frame rust, corrosion and oil filter rust out. Most of which has come from UK folks. 

Granted though many UK riders do use their scooters for commuting 12 months a year whereas we in the North America tuck our rides in for a long winter’s nap at the first sign of chilly weather.
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Meldrew
Visiting Curmudgeon
Meldrew

Number of posts : 3516
Location : York, North Yorkshire, England UK
Points : 7216
Registration date : 2010-11-16

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 21, 2020 3:24 am

My view on riding maxi scooters on salt treated roads has always been the same, wash it off as soon as possible with copious amounts of cold water. No matter how annoying and inconvenient it to do so dragging hoses and buckets about especially when it's cold and in bad light.

Relying solely on these wonder sprays doesn't really work whatever manufacturers and some owners claim. Drying the scooter off after cleaning is good practice too, I used to use a rechargeable leaf blower but it blew out cold air. For the last few years I've used an electric pet dryer to do the job, it does the job in minutes and being able to use powerful blasts of hot or warm air does it a lot more efficiently than the leaf blower.

As for rusting oil filters I remember that topic and was a bit mystified by it. I've never had that problem with the Champion oil filters I favoured using, not a patch of rust or corrosion on any of them. It's also pretty easy to knock up a home made front mud flap to keep road crud at bay.
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Mrmoz
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 32
Location : Uk
Points : 813
Registration date : 2018-08-23

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 21, 2020 7:23 am

So guys apart weather and road conditions is there any practical advice about the brake issue. Iam capable of stripping down but I've heard bleeding can be very tricky on a linked system
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Meldrew
Visiting Curmudgeon
Meldrew

Number of posts : 3516
Location : York, North Yorkshire, England UK
Points : 7216
Registration date : 2010-11-16

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 21, 2020 8:55 am

I'm not into tinkering at all, and I found brake bleeding on my Silver Wing to change the fluid very straight forward and simple.

On the front brake the sequence is upper bleed valve first, then the lower bleed valve, and finally the rear brake bleed valve. I use a syringe first  to remove most of the old brake fluid from the reservoirs to save time pushing it through the brake lines. Then add the new fluid as the old fluid is bled through the system into the container of my brake bleeding kit which has a non return valve. Then the reservoir is topped up with new fluid and diaphragm and cover reinstalled.

That's it, afterwards a few strokes to build up hydraulic pressure again, job done and no sponginess whatsoever. I also did that old hack of putting a Velcro strap round the compressed brake levers and leaving it overnight but it was completely unnecessary.
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Mech 1 twa
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Mech 1 twa

Number of posts : 930
Location : Allentown PA.
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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 21, 2020 4:16 pm

Lever is HARD to pull but has little brakes. It's not a bleeding-air in system problem. If lever pulled to bars and felt soft I'd say bleed. Caliper pistons or slides are stuck. Check pads for even wear. Jack it up and see if wheel rotates freely.
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exavid
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 2617
Age : 77
Location : Medford, Oregon
Points : 6841
Registration date : 2009-07-17

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeFri Feb 21, 2020 4:52 pm

One thing that often works is to sand the brake pads to break up any glazing and give the brake disc a bot of light sanding with a fine grit paper. Front brakes tend to get light use which tends to polish them more than wear them down as the rear brakes do. The linked braking system doesn't have much effect on the front brake. If the front brake lever doesn't slowly leak down while holding a bit of pressure on it there shouldn't be any problem hydraulically speaking.
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john grinsel
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john grinsel

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 22, 2020 6:26 am

First thing to remember, the youngest of these bikes is 7 years old----my experience with honda brakes riding in winter in Germany/US/Japan-----I took apart, cleaned up---never had stuck piston, but made sure pins were well greased. Always OEM pads for me.
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Mrmoz
Scooter Rider
Scooter Rider


Number of posts : 32
Location : Uk
Points : 813
Registration date : 2018-08-23

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeSat Feb 22, 2020 7:22 am

I've decided to take the caliper off and strip it down. I've just refurbished my suzuki bandit calipers and they look fantastic. So maybe I can do this more complicated system with a bit of patience' new seal kit is only 25 quid so it's worth having a go if I fail it will go to the garage thanks for all your Input guys much appreciate as always
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exavid
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 2617
Age : 77
Location : Medford, Oregon
Points : 6841
Registration date : 2009-07-17

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PostSubject: Re: Front brake issues    Front brake issues  I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 24, 2020 1:16 am

I've used EBC organic brake pads on several Goldwings and scooters. They perform well, hold up and don't wear the brake disks as sintered pads tend to do. Being a British company they might be cheaper to procure on the other side of the pond for our friends 'over there'.
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