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 Bad Stator, Part 2

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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 12:08

Replacing the stator was not a difficult job, but it is time consuming. My FSM doesn’t give the full procedure. In addition to the steps outlined by the FSM (Chapter 12) I also had to remove the bolt from the rear brake line junction block (hard brake line to flex line) and secure it out of the way; disconnect the parking brake cable and move it out of the way; remove the right side floor skirt; remove the muffler; drop the evap canister; and remove the exhaust header to gain unobstructed access to the right side crankcase cover. The three T-50 torx bolts were removed from the pivoting swingarm then it could be gently separated from the center swingarm and the pivot mount on the right crankcase cover.

Once there is clear access to the cover the four 10mm bolts and the eight 12mm bolts can be removed and the cover separated from the crankcase. Be mindful of those 12mm bolts because two of them are longer and are used at the two dowel locaters. The cover containing the stator coils can then be removed, but the strong magnetic flywheel will fight you on this. There are a couple of tabs on the perimeter of the cover which can be used as leverage points when trying to free the cover from the crankcase. The stator coil assembly is bolted inside the cover with three 5mm allen head bolts.

With everything apart I used a brass brush (similar to a tooth brush) to clean the crankcase and cover mating surfaces.

Reassembly is straightforward, but the wire harness grommets for the stator wires and the Pulse Generator wires want to keep falling out of their respective locations. I used Hondabond sealant on those grommets as well as the mating surfaces of the cover and crankcase. I inserted two 4” long 8mm and one 6mm (thread size) pieces of All Thread in various crankcase bolt holes to act as guides when replacing the cover. The non-hardening sealant allows some extra time and the All Thread guides help deal with the awkwardness of the magnetic flywheel pulling the cover in odd directions while you try you keep the wire harness grommets in place.

After reinstalling the cover I refilled the oil to the correct level and also lubed the needle bearings in the pivot arm before reattaching it back on the center swingarm. Reinstalling the exhaust header can be a bit of a PITA, but with the Evap Canister out of the way there is much better access to the acorn nuts securing the header plate to the cylinder head.

With the oil refilled and the exhaust system reattached I was able to start the scoot. I let it warm up to operating temp while I check for any oil leaks. With no oil leaks I next checked the battery voltage and found it to be –woo hoo!--14.5 volts. Right on the money.

I wish that there was some test to determine of the Rectifier/Regulator was bad, but short of a YouTube video illustrating a diode test --which may or may not be relavent-- the only other option is to replace the suspect R/R, and if the problem is solved then Bob's your uncle..
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bigbird
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 12:24

Thanks for the very thorough description of your stator troubleshooting and replacement, Tim. Between the FSM and your contribution, others can tackle this one themselves and save a LOT of money.
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Sknrdtec
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 12:45

Though I do not have stator issues , I like to copy any bits of extra info that is not in the FSM and place the copied pages in my service manual , from those that have experienced that task . And for that , and many other things about the site , I'm thankful . ST
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 15:47

After looking at the right crankcase cover off you can really see how well Honda  machinists are at making a fine product. I was surprised to find no gasket and only a thin layer of sealant.
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 16:10

Thank's for the head's up on removing your stator . Was there any discolouration of the stator compared to the replacement ? At what milage did it fail? Did your instrument panel show any sign that there was something wrong before the battery died?
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 17:22

tinman wrote:
Thank's for the head's up on removing your stator . Was there any discolouration of the stator compared to the replacement ? At what milage did it fail? Did your instrument panel show any sign that there was something wrong before the battery died?

No obvious discoloring of the coils on this stator. Although about 8 years ago I had a stator fail when I ran the scoot very low on oil during a two day high speed ride returning from Cape Breton. On that failure there was obvious discoloring on two of the coils.

Other than the "V" light thing, and the trip odo & clock resetting --ultimately due to an undercharged battery-- there was never any meter panel warning. In fact, if I hadn't have seen that YouTube running voltage output test I would have probably replaced the battery and then the regulator/rectifier, because the FSM tests seem to indicate that the stator was okay.

I have 88000 miles on the scoot. The stator just failed. I wish I could figure out why it failed this time.
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 28 Jul 2014, 23:51

88 k miles that's not a bad run .My 85 shadow failed at 17k kl..You should be good for another 88 k miles.
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bigbird
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Sun 10 Aug 2014, 16:51

Tim, in thinking about your successive stator failures, the only variable I can see is engine oil. Since the stator is immersed in oil, perhaps your oil of choice does not get along well with the varnish insulation on the stator coils? Have you always used the same oil? What manufacturer and type?
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Sun 10 Aug 2014, 17:56

Currently (over the last few years) I've been using the "High Mileage" version, Mobil 1, full synthetic, API Service SN, 10W-40,non energy conserving (w/o additives). Prior to that, since day two, I was using Mobil 1, full synthetic...blah, blah...
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bigbird
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Sun 10 Aug 2014, 21:13

Cosmic_Jumper wrote:
Currently (over the last few years) I've been using the "High Mileage" version, Mobil 1, full synthetic, API Service SN, 10W-40,non energy conserving (w/o additives). Prior to that, since day two, I was using Mobil 1, full synthetic...blah, blah...

I wonder if anyone else using Mobil 1 long term has suffered a stator burnout?

If we could get some responses from those who have replaced their stators, we could be on to something. Or not.
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Sun 10 Aug 2014, 21:35

I've never seen another post on any of the SW forums mentioning a stator needing replacement.
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bigbird
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Sun 10 Aug 2014, 22:44

Cosmic_Jumper wrote:
I've never seen another post on any of the SW forums mentioning a stator needing replacement.

I was quite sure I had seen at least a half dozen posts over the years here that stators had gone south. I'm aware of 2 in my own city, and there are maybe 2 dozen Silverwings here in a city of .75M people.
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 11 Aug 2014, 00:21

I'm not sure if I was still using dino oil or if I had switched to Amsoil when I had my stator burn out. I believe I have read about a few people who have had to replace a stator here, honda_silver was one. I will look through my old posts to see if I have commented on others that have had bad stators.
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 11 Aug 2014, 00:32

frustrated 
I've just looked for old posts but it seems that they only go back to February 2014. It may have something to do with the site running out of space. Hopefully the older posts aren't gone forever.   Sad
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 11 Aug 2014, 10:24

Roger, If you still recall the price would you care to share how much it cost you to have a dealer replace that stator for you? Assuming that a dealer or shop did the job. However, if you, ahem, 'encouraged' BigBird into coming down to Florida for a winter visit and then connived him into doing the job, it doesn't count.

Tim
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Stator, Part 2   Mon 11 Aug 2014, 17:23

I have a local shop that I gave my lift to that I do my own work at.(with him there to help if needed) So I really can't say what the labour would cost. I gave my old regulator/rectifier to him as I had bought a new one. My old one was still good and I figured he could use it as a test one. He ended up putting it in a Silverwing he bought at auction that just needed a new battery and regulator/rectifier so it worked out good for both of us.
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