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 Ultimate Touring Machine!

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B&M
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PostSubject: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeSat Jan 09, 2021 2:24 pm

I just wanted to share some positive news amidst the current times....

We bought a Silverwing 600 last year and set out planning a European road trip straight the way! We asked a few questions on here and got some great advise so wanted to share how awesome our experience was.

We scootered from the UK to the Italian Riviera, Pisa, Florence, Venice and the Great Dolomite Road which were all incredible on the Silverwing and the best way to see it all. The Bavarian Alpine Road, the Black forest road and back to the UK, 2 up on this incredible touring machine was better than we could ever have imagined!! It was so comfortable my girlfriend actually fall asleep twice on the back!!!

We are already planning our next adventure for when we can!

The soft saddlebags and the back box with the underseat storage gave us plenty of storage capacity for 2 for 10 days at the start of winter. What more could you ask for?!?!
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bikehiker
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeSat Jan 09, 2021 4:33 pm

Congratulations! Thanks for the confirmation that the SWing is a great, capable tour bike for one or two. Keep having fun!
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PeteP
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeSat Jan 09, 2021 6:22 pm

That sounds like my dream ride. I’ve always wanted to tour Europe on the saddle of any kind of bike. The USA is a big country with lots of things to see and do but Europe by bike is definitely on my bucket list!
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Dale N.
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeSat Jan 09, 2021 6:52 pm

That sounded like a very nice trip/ride. I saw Naples once when I was in the Navy but it wasn't much of a sight seeing trip. It would be nice to go back as a tourist.
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 9:26 am

My view on SilverWing as touring machine, had 2 new ones, rode for over 90,000 miles combined. They were great new but now old, low value---serious trouble on long trip cheapest=just leave and take the bus home.

My Suzuki dealer had old Burgman 650, very low mileage, 6,000 as I recall---cheap price. Ideal to buy for one long trip, leaving/junked if breaks and repair costs more than value of bike. Maybe should have bought it.

I think properly used and cared for SilverWing probably good for 100,000 miles or more. I usually ride my bikes out to 50,000 miles and trade....before I have to spend money to keep them going.
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 11:33 am

Mr Grinsel you show all the logic of a Bean Counter. Repair costs always exceed the value of the bike.

Spending $6-$7000 on a new Silverwing, and riding it for 50,000 miles translates to 14¢/mile as just the cost of the bike. So how much do you think would be a cost efficient amount to spend on a one-way bike?

What about that break down: if you are 2/3ds the way to Hyder and a tire self destructs do you bite the bullet and order a tire or do you eat crow and hop on the next Greyhound going home?

What’s the value of success? What’s the cost of failure?

Most of us here have a more than transactional relationship with our Silverwing and would need to think long and hard about leaving our bike behind.
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 12:12 pm

If you have now old SilverWing with little value----first try your road service----Dennis Kirk good source for overnite shipping on tire (shipping costs high) mount your self or use tire shop at least to get tire on rim and bead seated. put wheel on bike your self------major part failure probably just cheaper to leave bike, ride bus. Remember even in SilverWing Hayday Honda shops were not too good on fixing.

My point old, low value bikes=better to leave and go home. I am prepared with scooter/motorcycle for most tire emergencies/minor repair---scooter carry spare drive belt----recent years been on bike or scooter to North Cap in Norway/Hudson bay Road in Quebec/Central America/Japan and Korea/most of Europe----always got back......but on fresh machinery.
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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:27 pm

Ultimate Touring Machine! 20200910
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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:32 pm

Ultimate Touring Machine! 20200911
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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:34 pm

Ultimate Touring Machine! 20200912
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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:37 pm

Ultimate Touring Machine! Img-2010
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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:39 pm

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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:47 pm

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B&M
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Jan 11, 2021 5:49 pm

Thought we would include a couple of photos from our trip!
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 12, 2021 1:10 pm

Thanks for holiday pics, its most likely the best we're going to get for a while.
As soon as we get Covid pandemic back in its box I'm due some long bike trips.
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Highlandbear
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeThu Jan 14, 2021 2:21 am

Hello May I ask where you got saddlebags from ? Thanks
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Dale N.
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeFri Jan 15, 2021 9:18 pm

Very nice photos B&M. Thanks.
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BroOKS2K9
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19, 2021 3:48 pm

john grinsel wrote:
If you have now old SilverWing with little value----first try your road service----Dennis Kirk good source for overnite shipping on tire (shipping costs high)  mount your self or use tire shop at least to get tire on rim and bead seated.  put wheel on bike your self------major part failure probably just cheaper to leave bike, ride bus.    Remember even in SilverWing Hayday Honda shops were not too good on fixing.

My point old, low value bikes=better to leave and go home.   I am prepared with scooter/motorcycle for most tire emergencies/minor repair---scooter carry spare drive belt----recent years been on bike or scooter to North Cap in Norway/Hudson bay Road in Quebec/Central America/Japan and Korea/most of Europe----always got back......but on fresh machinery.

Mr. G, I don't understand the point of your post. Even the absolutely newest US Silverwing found somewhere in a box will be at least seven years old. Based on age alone, wouldn't that still be a "low value" bike? One would still have to get parts from the same places the '03 owner would. One would still have to deal with the same repair issues older bike owners have to. As long as one is best prepared as can be, the value will be there. Not in the bike, but in the ride...the journey yet to be experienced.
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19, 2021 4:54 pm

All SilverWing in US are now old period...if you are serious rider doing 20-30,000 miles per year. Really used instead of talked about ---I traded 2 bought new Silverwings, 2009 and 2013 at 50,000 miles or so. Neither had much value or did anybody really want them----they both went for about $3,000, when they were finally gone. My take, low value bikes/scooters are best in strange places----I have ridden in 15-20 countries. Never had to leave one, but delays can get very expensive. I also like to ride under warrany and tend to favor new, low cost bikes/scooters
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Easyrider
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19, 2021 4:56 pm

BroOKS2K9 wrote:
john grinsel wrote:
If you have now old SilverWing with little value----first try your road service----Dennis Kirk good source for overnite shipping on tire (shipping costs high)  mount your self or use tire shop at least to get tire on rim and bead seated.  put wheel on bike your self------major part failure probably just cheaper to leave bike, ride bus.    Remember even in SilverWing Hayday Honda shops were not too good on fixing.

My point old, low value bikes=better to leave and go home.   I am prepared with scooter/motorcycle for most tire emergencies/minor repair---scooter carry spare drive belt----recent years been on bike or scooter to North Cap in Norway/Hudson bay Road in Quebec/Central America/Japan and Korea/most of Europe----always got back......but on fresh machinery.

Mr. G, I don't understand the point of your post.  Even the absolutely newest US Silverwing found somewhere in a box will be at least seven years old.  Based on age alone, wouldn't that still be a "low value" bike?  One would still have to get parts from the same places the '03 owner would.  One would still have to deal with the same repair issues older bike owners have to.  As long as one is best prepared as can be, the value will be there.  Not in the bike, but in the ride...the journey yet to be experienced.  

+1
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BroOKS2K9
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jan 19, 2021 9:41 pm

john grinsel wrote:
All SilverWing in US are now old period...if you are serious rider doing 20-30,000 miles per year.   Really used instead of talked about   ---I traded 2 bought new Silverwings, 2009 and 2013 at 50,000 miles or so.  Neither had much value or did anybody really want them----they both went for about $3,000,  when they were finally gone.   My take, low value bikes/scooters are best in strange places----I have ridden in 15-20 countries.   Never had to leave one, but delays can get very expensive.   I also like to ride under warrany and tend to favor new, low cost bikes/scooters

Mr. G.,
Old or not, that's not where the "value" is when it comes to scooting/motorcycling. Based on your words of who qualifies as being a "serious rider", the vast majority of automobile drivers in this country couldn't be considered "serious drivers". I'd bet the vast majority of people on this site who have any interest whatsoever in scootering/motorcycling, don't even care about being a "serious rider." Why? Is there value only in being a "serious rider" or in just riding...seriously?

I can assure you I take it very seriously when riding my 11y.o. daughter ten miles to the skate park. Why? We, like all riders, want to get to our destination. I value the simplicity of getting on a bike, prepared as necessary, and just going: two wheels, a motor, the open air and just...going. Where? Wherever the journey may take me for that particular ride.

A ride to the grocery store that leads to 20 miles extra in going "the back way" home. Been there and done that!!!. The ride to the post office where you happen to meet another scooter/motorcycle rider. You talk for sometime, take interest in each other's bike, maybe exchange numbers and meet up sometime later for a ride. To where? As long as all are safe and enjoy it, does it really matter?

I respect the miles you've put on all the bikes you've ridden over the years, rubber-band or no. But what I gather from the post is a love for the number of miles and the preparedness you put into those miles. What I don't gather is the value of all that came between mile #1 and mile #X-- the end of the journey. Because if that were where the value is, who would care at all about (resale) value?
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 20, 2021 8:19 am

Serious rider----uses bike/scooter for all transport needs. 66 years for me---over time you get professional motorcycle/weather clothes, etc.---tools, etc. When bike is used for everything, you tend to take care of it, get rid of it at the right time----bikes have taken me to 15-20 countries, long stays in Japan and Germany, over 20 years each. I like to ride only under warranty if possible---my Kymco XTown 300i just fell out of the 2 year warranty----goes up for sale next Thursday. Secret to lots of riding, don't get married as that requires sharing money and time.----I suggest you try some long distance trips......they are fun.
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BroOKS2K9
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 20, 2021 2:28 pm

john grinsel wrote:
Serious rider----uses bike/scooter for all transport needs.   66 years for me---over time you get professional motorcycle/weather clothes, etc.---tools, etc.   When bike is used for everything, you tend to take care of it, get rid of it at the right time----bikes have taken me to 15-20 countries, long stays in Japan and Germany, over 20 years each.   I like to ride only under warranty if possible---my Kymco XTown 300i just fell out of the 2 year warranty----goes up for sale next Thursday.  Secret to lots of riding, don't get married as that requires sharing money and time.----I suggest you try some long distance trips......they are fun.

Serious rider? Okay, I'll bite.
*I use my bike to ride to work. Am I a serious rider?
*I use my bike to get groceries. Am I a serious rider yet?
*I use my bike to go to the post office. How about now?
*I use my bike to go to church. Ah ha!! Now...nope?
*I use my bike to go to lunch. Cold?
*I use my bike to go to Lowe's and Home Depot. Still cold?
*I've used my bike in freezing temperatures. Not there yet?
*I've used my bike in blistering temperature. Not quite?
*I even use my bike to do nothing except ride more than 50+ miles in and around my town and surrounding suburbs on a regular basis. Just to ride for the heck of riding. Absolutely not a serious rider with that one, right?
*I don't, and will likely never own professional motorcycle/weather clothes. Still not serious enough yet?
*I use my bike to ride my daughter around and share my time with...just for fun. Okay! That makes me serious right? No!?!
*I use my bike to even take her to and pick her up from school. Wait...no?
*I've used my bike to ride my (greatest gift of all) wife around with. Absolutely not a serious rider with that one, right?
*I've used my bike to share my life and riding experience with others. Whew!!
Surely....? What!?! Not yet?

And for the piece de resistance...
*I do my own maintenance and repairs? Still not serious enough?

How about "absurd enough"?

A "long distance trip" is relative or are you the definer of that phrase? For some (motorcycle 'posers') on their ultra chromed out, overly shiny and nowhere-near-ergonomic bikes, 50 miles once a quarter --if that-- is a long distance trip. For someone else, a 300+ mile, one-way trip just to ride a newly purchased bike (with no windshield) back home is a long distance trip. I can assure you, both riders were serious about the ride: serious about being in the moment, serious about being in the wind, serious about possibly being stranded on the side of the road, serious about what his/her butt felt like afterwards and serious about finally getting off the bike after having experienced what either would surely deem a valued time on the bike. For those few moments, for those few (to you) miles, they are serious riders.

The "secret to lots of riding" isn't in not being married.... The "secret to lots of riding" is liking the ride so much that regardless of whoever, whatever, or however you share, split, fracture or splinter your time with, the last ride only urges you to get on the bike again and purge yourself, if only for the briefest of moments, of all else going on and enjoy the ride you're about to take. Seriously!!
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Mech 1 twa
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 20, 2021 9:59 pm

Nice photos B&M. Enjoy your newer bike many good rides to come on SW.
Looks like this thread snow balled into something else but keep sharing.

Ride ON. thumbs up
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BroOKS2K9
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Jan 20, 2021 11:41 pm

Yes. Great photos. Great inspiration too. Thanks.
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ishmac
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeFri Jan 22, 2021 2:31 am

Hi B&M;

Great photos you've posted, the Silverwing is a very underated machine. What is the make of the aftermarket exhaust and what make are those orange saddlebags please..?
Cheers.

Peter
Scotland
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dencart2
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PostSubject: What an exciting trip.   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 22, 2021 12:17 pm

WoW, sounds like a article from travel magazine.
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http://denniscarter.net/Trips
AldusFran
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeMon Feb 22, 2021 2:43 pm

B&M , the first photo looks like the Dolomites near Val Gardena near where my folks were born. Breath taking indeed. Thanks
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Chris Olson
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 16, 2021 2:06 pm

john grinsel wrote:
Secret to lots of riding, don't get married as that requires sharing money and time.

I would disagree. Wife and I have ridden together since 1982. She has mostly ridden her own bike because very few two-up tourers fit us. She is 5' 11" and only 145 lbs so she can't handle a heavy bike but the Silver Wing fits her pretty good.

For two-up we have had both Goldwings and Harley Electra Glides. The Harley fits her (and me) better than the Goldwing for two-up. It has more leg room and not near as cramped for space as the Goldwing.

But still, we have plenty of breakdowns over the years on various motorcycles when we've been out touring. We fix 'em and continue on - would never consider leaving one behind just because it's a "cheap" bike.

Sharing the touring miles with my wife over the last 38 years has made touring MORE enjoyable. If it was just me and leave my wife at home I wouldn't do it.
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Loosemarbles
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Mar 16, 2021 5:50 pm

I would happily get myself and my better half onto my old SW now and ride it to the south of France and back. Although it has low mileage, it has been neglected in the past. It still has one or two little niggles which I will attend to in time. However, all the fundamentals are sound after many hours of D.I.Y.ing, and some help from the shop but I've never had to touch the engine. My faith lies in Honda with that part.

I'm planning on a trip to the Continent this year. I'm sure the 20 year 'ole gal' will oblige...'to infinity and beyond'.....well, Paris would do to start with Exclamation
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GHM-PM
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 17, 2021 8:16 am

Thanks for the pictures B&M.  Looks like a great trip. For me the SW is a superb one-up touring steed. A bit too small for two-up in my case but whatever works. Plus my wife would want to bring along the kitchen sink!!!
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Meldrew
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 17, 2021 1:20 pm

I'm fine with solo touring which is my default setting anyway. I enjoyed the years Mrs M accompanied me and now she's hung up her helmet and I've downsized, I'm used to solo touring again.

It'll be interesting how it goes riding in the post Brexit EU this year or whenever it's safe to travel there again. But currently some of their politicians are being being arseholes about it and still can't get it through their thick skins we've left.
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smellybeard
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 17, 2021 2:33 pm

Meldrew wrote:
It'll be interesting how it goes riding in the post Brexit EU this year or whenever it's safe to travel there again.
I've been talking to some truckers and they give me the impression that ferry space from Ireland to France will be very hard to come by this summer and that we lowly tourists will have to use the land-bridge. Bit if a pain if you're hading down the west coast to Spain.
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 17, 2021 3:35 pm

It's not just brexit, it's also whatever travel restrictions are in place to manage covid by our Government and the destination country. Much as I hate restrictions I'll accept it if it helps keep the virus mutations out!
I'll be staying in the UK this year, fortunately there is still plenty bits I haven't fully explored yet.
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smellybeard
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Mar 17, 2021 4:53 pm

For me though the old routes, I think, are permanently distorted. I'm not expecting to get out of Ireland this year but next year and beyond, trucks will still be avoiding the UK and using up all the direct capacity forcing private traffic, which faces fewer restrictions, to use routes through the UK. Rather than 24 hours on a ship and arriving rested in France, I face a run from south Wales across M4 or from Holyhead down the the A55, M56, M6, M25 and on into the 'wrong' part of France. I don't particularly like being stuck on a ship but it beats an extra night in an hotel and an extra day of motorway driving.
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steveR
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 08, 2021 4:58 pm

smellybeard wrote:
For me though the old routes, I think, are permanently distorted. I'm not expecting to get out of Ireland this year but next year and beyond, trucks will still be avoiding the UK and using up all the direct capacity forcing private traffic, which faces fewer restrictions, to use routes through the UK. Rather than 24 hours on a ship and arriving rested in France, I face a run from south Wales across M4 or from Holyhead down the the A55, M56, M6, M25 and on into the 'wrong' part of France. I don't particularly like being stuck on a ship but it beats an extra night in an hotel and an extra day of motorway driving.

As an annual visitor to The West, usually on a bike, I totally concur. The ferries seem to be a lotter anyway as to whether they even are running on any given day!

Your comments reminded me of an occasional bike buddy from NW Scotland, who tended to jump across to N.Ireland from Stranraer, scoot down through Ireland and then catch a ferry to NW France. Much more relaxing all round Cool
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steveR
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeTue Jun 08, 2021 5:03 pm

smellybeard wrote:
Meldrew wrote:
It'll be interesting how it goes riding in the post Brexit EU this year or whenever it's safe to travel there again.
I've been talking to some truckers and they give me the impression that ferry space from Ireland to France will be very hard to come by this summer and that we lowly tourists will have to use the land-bridge. Bit if a pain if you're hading down the west coast to Spain.

Once upon a time, ferry companies would always squeeze in a couple of bikes, but they have got increasingly difficult in recent years...

BF are the worst by far with their "you must book a cabin" policy. I have done the sailing into Pompey on several occasions and used to grab a sleep mat and bag off the bike, and doss down in the Lounge. Much better than the horrible couchettes!!
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Meldrew
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 09, 2021 3:25 am

steveR wrote:

Once upon a time, ferry companies would always squeeze in a couple of bikes, but they have got increasingly difficult in recent years...

BF are the worst by far with their "you must book a cabin" policy.  I have done the sailing into Pompey on several occasions and used to grab a sleep mat and bag off the bike, and doss down in the Lounge. Much better than the horrible couchettes!!

I haven't found it a problem taking a bike/scooter on ferries since the Eighties, I started taking my own ratchet straps and pads to tie the bike down after I was handed a couple of lengths of oily rope on a crossing from Stranraer to Larne.

The ferries I use mainly go from Hull to Rotterdam, or Zeebrugge and there's designated areas for motorcycles, either on elevated car decks, or areas away from cars and HGV's with a heavy duty steel cable stretched along the deck to secure the tie down straps to.


I'm all for ferry companies now insisting you book a cabin or at least a berth in one because over the years passengers dossing down in lounges was getting out of hand. Instead of going in there to sleep at about 10pm onwards when the lounges empty and people off to their cabins for the night.  It's long became the norm for a minority of selfish passengers to head for the lounges as soon as they board the ferry.

There they spread themselves and their kit all round the seats and sofas like squatters with complete disregard to the needs of other passengers and families.  There they stay for the whole crossing, with some going off for meals and drinks while their cronies guard their patch. Rather like Germans with their towels on sun beds.

Not using a cabin and getting your head down where you can is basically sleeping in your clothes. I much prefer to come up off the car deck with my overnight bag and go straight to my cabin. Get the riding gear off, have a shower and change into casual gear.
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steveR
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PostSubject: Re: Ultimate Touring Machine!   Ultimate Touring Machine! I_icon_minitimeWed Jun 09, 2021 5:01 am

Meldrew wrote:
steveR wrote:

Once upon a time, ferry companies would always squeeze in a couple of bikes, but they have got increasingly difficult in recent years...

BF are the worst by far with their "you must book a cabin" policy.  I have done the sailing into Pompey on several occasions and used to grab a sleep mat and bag off the bike, and doss down in the Lounge. Much better than the horrible couchettes!!


There they spread themselves and their kit all round the seats and sofas like squatters with complete disregard to the needs of other passengers and families.  There they stay for the whole crossing, with some going off for meals and drinks while their cronies guard their patch. Rather like Germans with their towels on sun beds.

Not using a cabin and getting your head down where you can is basically sleeping in your clothes. I much prefer to come up off the car deck with my overnight bag and go straight to my cabin. Get the riding gear off, have a shower and change into casual gear.

DFDS (I think) were notororious for having no space to sleep/lie or book a cabin, and the lounge looked like a  refugee ship some nights I agree!!

I do like a cabin with a mate, if I am doing a proper overnighter as you describe, and do so on the BF crossings to St Malo/Caen, as it means a good nights kip, and then on the road at 6am and be well away from the Channel ports before finding breakfast. It used to be a nice boulangerie, but more recently, it'll be a dive into a handy supermarket and grab enough for a picnic in a quiet field gateway Wink
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