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PostSubject: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 03, 2010 3:28 pm

I filled my tank up right to the top when I first got the bike and then I reset the trip meter.
My flashing one bar came on at around 81miles!
Is that normal for inner city traffic usage?

I have no heavy luggage and a stock windscreen.
I'm 5'11" & 90kg so I'm not a fatty either.

Fuelly is telling me
9.5 L/100km
29.7 UK MPG
24.8 US MPG


Last edited by Premises187 on Thu Oct 21, 2010 5:00 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 03, 2010 4:05 pm

Seems like very poor mileage to me. I can usually get nearly 100 miles before the fuel gauge hit half way in mixed city and freeway riding.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 03, 2010 4:23 pm

Very bad I would say.

I top up at 130 miles and have two or three bars!!!

Worth investigating!!
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 03, 2010 5:30 pm

The question that needs to be asked is... How much fuel does it take to fill it back up? If it's only a couple of gallons or less, you likely have a bad fuel sensor or such. If it is taking 3 or more gallons, then you are getting miserable fuel milage or have a fuel leak.

We had a member with a similar problem a couple of months ago, and his turned out to be a bad fuel sensor (the bike had sat for a couple of years as I recall, and it was apparently gunked up). It would only take less than two gallons to fill it up, so his mileage was OK... his system simply would not let him use all of it. He was trying all sorts of fuel system cleaners, but I don't recall hearing if that solved his problem, or he had to replace the fuel sensor.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSun Oct 03, 2010 5:55 pm

I filled it up 2 miles after light flashing.
My Shell receipt tells me I filled up with 12.12 litres (on centre stand)
Does that sound about right?

It is possible when I first filled up I did it on the side stand (I dunno if that matters much)

Anyway I'll monitor it closely this time round.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 04, 2010 1:46 am

Approx 12 litres on flashing LCD bar is very close to my consumption,
that converts to about 230 km travelling distance. in Comparison, I get about 320km
on my 660 single MuZ for 12/14 litres with the same riding style and speeds.
The Swing sure is comfortable tho.

Wait till you ride it 2 up and use some of the power.......................Last weekend I got about 150km for 10 litres 2 up
and passing speeds up to about 145km/h cruising speeds around the 110-120 mark..................................................
make a list of possible fuelstops before you leave home.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 04, 2010 8:09 am

Your original post translates to about 25mpg, which is in fact poor. Since it is a new bike for you and the maintenance history is vague or unknown I would try some gas treatment (Seafoam or other injector cleaner) and I would check the air filter and maybe change the plugs. Most of us get between low 40s to as much as high 50mpgs. Good luck and welcome!
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Premises187
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 05, 2010 4:35 pm

I've lost my first 2 bars already at 35 miles.

I saw another guy in another topic saying he lost 1 bar at 55miles with his big givi screen. Neutral

The servicing is all up to scratch according to the paperwork. Cant always believe what you read.

I've ordered a can of Seafoam.
On my next day off I'll be taking a look at the spark plugs and belt.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 05, 2010 5:16 pm

Hi,

Checking out your spark plugs is a good idea. They sure can tell allot about the way the motor is using fuel.

One of the things that might be good to look at is your Fuel Pressure Regulator. After setting for a while, they have a tendency to start leaking fuel into their vacuum control hose, connected to them and that will cause your fuel to leach off into your air intake and makes for poor MPG's.

Item # 13

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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 06, 2010 2:30 am

Hey Dennis.
You could be onto something here.

Would cleaning it out be enough to fix it?
Ie would Seafoam clean it? Or manually open it and clean it?

or 2) would it have to be a replacement part job?

Thanks
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 06, 2010 5:01 am

How fast are you going at 5000 RPM ?Cruising . Need to know to tell if it is
engine or trans problem . Do you notice any raw gas smell ?
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 06, 2010 6:22 am

While riding I have noticed a gas smell but that's when I duck my head down around gas cap area, but I couldnt see anything leaking around the actual gas cap. I thought it could be normal.

Also to note there is a bit of white smoke when I first start the bike to warm it up in the morning. We've had a lot of rain lately so I was wondering if that's just rain water evaporating from inside the exhaust pipe or perhaps it could be caused by extra fuel that's leaked into the airbox like Dennis described.

I will find out the 5000rpm speed when I leave work.

Thanks again.
It sounds like we're getting closer to an answer.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 06, 2010 6:38 am

I get white smoke from my machine in the morning, especially after a damp night. It's just the moisture in the exhaust system evaporating. If you look at most cars they do the same this time of year.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 06, 2010 7:56 am

Hey P187,

The Fuel Pressure Regulator (FPR) is a replacement part only and cannot be repaired. They are around $40.00 for the part here in the states and best you replace the seal #18 also. To gain access for the repair you will need to remove the seat and the top cover under the seat.

After you get the FPR installed and before you re-install the panel and seat, run the bike and check for fuel leaks in the FI system.

Hope this helps.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeWed Oct 06, 2010 8:12 am

For interest's sake; I returned 45 MPG on my trip to the UK at the weekend.
I was battling the elements and trying to maintain 70 MPH for over 500 miles so the Silverwing was working very hard.
Undoubtedly the MPG suffers at speeds over 60 MPH.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 08, 2010 2:50 pm

Thanks again as always.

I stumbled across a very interesting internet conversation.
The guy had a Silverwing with the exact same problem as me. According to him SeaFoam fixed his problem

On the left click on "View Full Conversation"
http://www.justanswer.com/questions/3s0yk-i-have-a-2003-honda-silverwing-scooter-fsc600-when-i-fill


Also while I was looking up info on the Fuel Pressure Regulator I found this convo on Silverwing org
This guy was talking about his FPR.
Quote :
I had one go bad on my 2002. Symptoms was it began getting harder to start, then not running for very long. You could smell very rich running through the exhaust, including black smoke. It finally deteriorated to the point it wouldn't start. Mine had sat for almost 4 years however, so the diaphram inside it probably rotted. Put through a tank of seafoam and she's back to brand new status!


My Seafoam came today and I'm running my first tank of it
1 oz per 1 gallon of fuel

Will see what happens.
Cheers
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 08, 2010 4:17 pm

Good luck!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 09, 2010 2:04 am

I'm not a believer in "miracle-in-a-can" but I do use Sea Foam in my bikes and truck fairly regularly every six months or so. The stuff did good work on my GL1500 once when it was idling a bit rough. It isn't all that expensive and hasn't hurt anything. Sometimes the 'placebo' effect is worth it if that's all that's going on.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 8:08 am

Excell wrote:
How fast are you going at 5000 RPM ?Cruising .
I'm getting an indicated 65mph at 5k.

Tyre pressure is 100% fine.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 11:05 am

A picture of the spark plugs.
The plug on the left was notably more oily than the plug on the right.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 11:19 am

Hi P187,

Both plugs look gas washed...just a little to much gas entering the combustion chamber.

If all was well wth the scooter, your sparkplug electroids, should be DRY and light tan or light brown.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 12:40 pm

The plug on the right looks like you may have cleaned it up a bit with a wire brush. Is that so?
Were you referring to the oiliness being on the threads? If so, that's very normal. I don't see any oiliness on the electrodes.

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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 1:15 pm

Thanks again.
No wire brushes used. This is the first time I've seen my Silverwings plugs.
I've replaced them now.

So far I've reached 89 miles and I've got 2 fuel bars left.
This is an improvement over last time.

I will fill up again and give treatment of Seafoam once I hit 1 bar.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 11:16 pm

You should have that many miles at a half tank if things were normal. You should expect at least 180 miles/tank. Give or take a few. Something does seem a little out of the ordinary for your scoot. If you have replaced the plugs, after a complete tank of fuel has been used, recheck your plugs again. They should be as Dennis states above.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeMon Oct 11, 2010 11:22 pm

Most folks seem to get more miles out of their tank than I do, but even under full load and high sustained speeds, I still would be able to get at least 105 to 115 miles before the reserve light comes on. Remember, when the last fuel bar comes on, it means you have about 1 gallon of gas remaining (I know it's supposed to be 0.9 gallons but when I've filled up right as the light came on, I actually put 1.0 gallons in exactly). When the first bar goes off, you've used up 1 gallon of gas. I've reached 90 before with 2 bars remaining, but then went up to 105 before the last bar came on, so that might not be too weird.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 12, 2010 7:06 am

Talking UK measurements ie, Imperial Gallons. With 2 bars remaining I have usually 130 (ish) miles registered. I have calculated with the remaining fuel I could get 180 miles per tank.

Methinks a little more investigating may be the order of the day!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 12, 2010 8:36 am

Doug... sounds like the problem may not be as bad as it sounds over here. It is always good to have all the factors before making decisions.

P187... you may not have a problem after all. Good news for you.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeTue Oct 12, 2010 10:36 am

Opalsboy wrote:
Doug... sounds like the problem may not be as bad as it sounds over here. It is always good to have all the factors before making decisions.

P187... you may not have a problem after all. Good news for you.

Gary, P187 still has a deficit of 41 miles. At 2 bars he is indicating 89 miles whilst I show 130 at 2 bars. Using the mpg vs tank size I therefor get 180 miles per tank. (Does that make sense?)

Hence my, still got a problem that may need further delving!!!

I have no idea what might be the cause of the problem. It's a shame he cannot get hold of a spare serviceable sender/sensor to rule that side out. I do hate those sort of problems.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Oct 21, 2010 1:46 pm

Premises187 wrote:
Thanks again as always.

I stumbled across a very interesting internet conversation.
The guy had a Silverwing with the exact same problem as me. According to him SeaFoam fixed his problem

On the left click on "View Full Conversation"
http://www.justanswer.com/questions/3s0yk-i-have-a-2003-honda-silverwing-scooter-fsc600-when-i-fill


Also while I was looking up info on the Fuel Pressure Regulator I found this convo on Silverwing org
This guy was talking about his FPR.
Quote :
I had one go bad on my 2002. Symptoms was it began getting harder to start, then not running for very long. You could smell very rich running through the exhaust, including black smoke. It finally deteriorated to the point it wouldn't start. Mine had sat for almost 4 years however, so the diaphram inside it probably rotted. Put through a tank of seafoam and she's back to brand new status!


My Seafoam came today and I'm running my first tank of it
1 oz per 1 gallon of fuel

Will see what happens.
Cheers


That "Mike" in the conversation, was me. I added 1/2 can to two different tanks and saw a little improvement. The last time, I added a full can to a full tank and it seemed to clear everything up. I am not getting 55-60 MPG and the gauge seems to be working properly.

Before I bought it, my bike sat for about 2 years with what I'm guessing a about 1/2 tank of gas. The result was a stock float, which the Seafoam seemed to clear. I too, am leery of the "miracle in a can", but in this case, it worked.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Oct 21, 2010 3:24 pm

mikef wrote:

That "Mike" in the conversation, was me. I added 1/2 can to two different tanks and saw a little improvement. The last time, I added a full can to a full tank and it seemed to clear everything up. I am not getting 55-60 MPG and the gauge seems to be working properly.

Before I bought it, my bike sat for about 2 years with what I'm guessing a about 1/2 tank of gas. The result was a stock float, which the Seafoam seemed to clear. I too, am leery of the "miracle in a can", but in this case, it worked.

Ahhhh, the man himself!

I got the blinking bar at 78 miles this time so I guess nothing was remedied.

Fuelly is telling me
9.5 L/100km
29.7 UK MPG
24.8 US MPG

So far I have been through 2 tanks and I've only been putting 3.5oz of Seafoam into each of them. Not had much difference yet. I guess 1oz per gallon isn't enough.

I'm gonna just dump my last 3rd of the bottle in.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Oct 21, 2010 5:44 pm

I finally added a full can to the tank, before I had any change. You may have a different problem. How does it run?
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Oct 21, 2010 6:48 pm

mikef wrote:
You may have a different problem. How does it run?

It starts up first time on every cold morning and the idle sounds steady.
It auto-chokes around 1.9k rpm and then idles at 1k rpm

Cant speak for performance because this is my first encounter with a Siverwing.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 22, 2010 6:23 am

I just read your post 65 mph at 5000 is good . I would at this point take the seat off and check the vacuum lines to the fuel regulator,make sure they are not cracked or disconnected. I probably would have replaced the plugs while they were out . There is only two eliminate that possibility .Pull the wires off the injectors look for signs of green corrosion or rust . Carefully don't want to break anything .If you don't find any thing here you will either replace the fuel regulator ,or what I would do is check the fuel pressure .
In your case it will be cheaper to replace the reg . I already have a gauge .
If you find all of this terribly confusing ,find a good tech and pay him to do it for you . I assume that you have a shop manual it is necessary at this point .I hope this helps .
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeFri Oct 22, 2010 8:43 pm

I haven't been thrilled with the mileage of my SW. The last fill up yielded 43mpg. That's mostly around town riding solo. Last Saturday riding two up on the Goldwing 1800 over mountains with a 4000' altitude gain the GW got 43mpg for the 230 mile ride. I know the CVT isn't the most efficient transmission but I'd expected a bit less fuel consumption. The scooter runs like new, no smoke, instant starting, just like you'd expect. I haven't torn into the bike to see what's going on yet, in fact I might have most of the problem in my right wrist. Maybe I'm going to have to quit intersection drags with HDs.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeSat Oct 23, 2010 1:55 am

I've noticed my mileage changes greatly in town. I definitely have a quick wrist thing going, from stop lights. While on the highway, I'm getting about 50-55, but in town, hitting the lights hard, it drops down too. It seems like it really revs, until it gets moving. My plugs and air filter are new. I'm wondering if there is some kind of clutch adjustment. Now, where is that manual?
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 8:17 pm

mikef wrote:
It seems like it really revs, until it gets moving.
It's a heavy bugger to get moving so I can imagine it'll be thirsty on acceleration. Once its got momentum it will only need to sip fuel to keep moving.

I'm actually hoping I've got a fixable problem that's causing the 9.5 L/100km rather than it being the norm in city traffic.

Can anyone tell me the where I'd find these fuel lines I need to check out for possible leaks?
I imagine it'd be just under the seat hatch in rubber hoses right?

Also any idea how much digging I need to do to find the Fuel Pressure Regulator?

I plan to have a good poke around tomorrow and hopefully get some answers.

Thanks
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 8:35 pm

Take the seat off and it is right on top .You had better have a shop manual handy or you will be lost .
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lesley & John
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeFri Dec 17, 2010 3:43 pm

ive a similar problem to you ive renewed the spark plugs checked and balanced the throttle bodies and renewed the air filter.im getting around 110 to the tank before the light starts flashing.this takes around 13 litres to then fill.i just put this down to hard launches at every set of lights and the fact she is now coming up to 65000.im reading 5300 at 70mph but i also have renewed the ramp plate and standard rollers.mines pulling away at 2600 which i presume to be about right
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Apr 19, 2012 5:20 am

I have been following this discussion with interest. My tank was filled yesterday with 12.91L which gave me a range of 272km. This distance included a daily commute with speeds rarely exceeding 80km/h. Judging from the discussion, this seems quite normal. I have yet to take the SW on a long trip.
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Premises187
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Apr 19, 2012 6:03 am

Hey guys, I'm just here to say that my bad tank range was down to my aggressive riding, riding with pillion & the amount of traffic lights here in central London.
I've since owned a Yamaha FZ6 & a Kawasaki ER6f. Both bikes returned MPG in the low 30's with me at the controls.

Even my Gilera Nexus 250 is giving a constant 50mpg which is supposed to be really bad.


Thanks for the help.
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Apr 19, 2012 2:42 pm

Premises187 wrote:
Hey guys, I'm just here to say that my bad tank range was down to my aggressive riding, riding with pillion & the amount of traffic lights here in central London.

Thanks for the help.

I have a similar problem here in Dorset!!!!! Rolling Eyes No point riding like a wuss. The throttle is for opening. I have always been a believer in, if the fuel conumption is a worry - then ride a smaller engined bike! Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: Bad Tank Range?   Bad Tank Range? I_icon_minitimeThu Apr 19, 2012 4:28 pm

Fuel consumption and tank range matter to me, I'm glad I don't run one of the earlier models that gave the Silver Wing it's thirsty reputation. At the prices we are currently paying I'd hate to be filling up a near empty tank every 120-130 miles or looking around nervously for the next filling station when the trip meter is showing 100 miles or so. It's not about having to ride like a wuss either, I want 200 miles out of a tankful, or as near as possible before going onto reserve which seems to be around the 170-180 miles mark at the moment.

I bought my Silver Wing mainly for touring and long runs and I'm happy enough with the mpg. I certainly wouldn't swap the weather protection and storage capacity of the Silver Wing for one of the new Honda 700C or 700X bikes with better fuel consumption and not much else.
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