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 Warning lights coming on

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Loosemarbles
Silver Wing Expert
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Loosemarbles

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PostSubject: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 23, 2020 3:21 pm

A few weeks ago I noticed that when starting up my SW the ‘V’ came on when I pressed the starter button but as soon as the engine fired up it went out.

Yesterday, when I turned on the ignition switch all the usual lights came on and all relevant ones went out once the buzzing noise stopped, but when I pressed the starter switch the Water light, along with the ‘V’ light and ‘FI’ came on until the engine fired up and all the lights went out.

I have only seen the ‘V’ light come on at 16,000 and 32,000 miles. Normal. (I always change my belt before its time is up).

The only change I have made to the factory fitted wiring is the LED brake lights on my top box which I tapped into the brake light wire at the back end.

Electrics are my weak suit when it comes to bike DIY. Does anybody have any idea why these other lights are coming on momentarily?
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Cosmic_Jumper
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Cosmic_Jumper

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Warning lights coming on Empty
PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 23, 2020 8:20 pm

I always thought that the system did a self test sweep of all the indicator lights and fuel gauge when the key was first turned ON. Then the “V” light remained ON until the motor started. But you have a 2001 model so I could be wrong.


Last edited by Cosmic_Jumper on Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Dale N.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 23, 2020 9:07 pm

I agree with Tim. When starting it up it goes through a "system check" so to speak. My 08 SWing does that also. My 2006 pickup does that also. When starting it ALL the dash lights come on for a second or two then go out as long as everything it OK.
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bweighmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeMon Nov 23, 2020 11:48 pm

If V light stays on , it needs to be re set . It is programmed to send a message to check belt . It is Not a warning light , just a reminder light ....
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Terry Smith
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 2:21 am

I ran my Swing with no working alternator for a few months, running completely off a charged battery. I had a couple of instances arriving back home on the last few joules in the battery when the low voltage caused a few dash lights to come on, I do recall the high water temp and low oil pressure lights illuminating while the engine was still just running. So any unusual dash light action could be from a low battery voltage at that point.
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bweighmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 3:19 am

This means the computer has been sent false signals by the sensors .. Installing a new battery and having the system re set is in order ...
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 4:17 am

All the lights should illuminate as part of the startup process so you know they work but I guess you know that and what your are saying is they are doing something new, different and exciting!
Firstly disconnect what you connected first to see if thats the culprit. Along with switching it off and on again this is the limit of my knowledge of electrickery.
The V light should only stay on 1) at 16k to remind you to change the belt, and 2) if its detected a disparity in the drive train that the ECU interprets as a slipping belt (even if it isn't).
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bweighmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 4:27 am

The V light comes on automaticly at 16 K intervals as a reminder only .. there are No sensors to indicate a belt problem Even if the belt breaks there are no indicators to tell the system there is a problem .. It is just a reminder light only .....
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 7:03 am

steve_h80 wrote:
All the lights should illuminate as part of the startup process so you know they work [snip]
The V light should only stay on 1) at 16k to remind you to change the belt, and 2) if its detected a disparity in the drive train that the ECU interprets as a slipping belt (even if it isn't).

+1 to what steve_h80 says here. The “V” light is more than “just a reminder...” as many who’ve upgraded the variator with lighter roller/slider weights or a JCosta-type variator have found out. Not a matter of, too much, concern though if you know your scoot. 

But if you’re using a bargain priced aftermarket belt and the “V” light comes on prematurely then you might want to exercise due diligence.
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Loosemarbles
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Loosemarbles

Number of posts : 575
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 8:33 am

Thanks all. The battery is about 5 years old and it's a nil-maintenance gel type. I keep a battery tender attached if the bike is left for any length of time. It could be time for a change though.

On my 2001 all the lights go out after the system check apart from the oil light.

I have had 26g rollers for the last 5 years...(soon to be changed to 26g sliders)...so that could be the V light culprit.

I'll keep an eye on things and I bet when I check it this afternoon it will all work fine! Intermittent faults? GRRRRRRR!
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 10:17 am

Loosemarbles
You might have a point about the battery, on other bikes I've had the assorted lights flash if the engine hasn't fired due to the battery been on its way out.
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 10:28 am

bweighmaster wrote:
The V light comes on automaticly at 16 K intervals as a reminder only .. there are No sensors to indicate a belt problem Even if the belt breaks there are no indicators to tell the system there is a problem .. It is just a reminder light only .....

There isn't a sensor as such but there is the speedo that reads off the back wheel which gives one set of data to the ECU, the engine revs the other. Deep in its little silicon brain the ECU compares the two and the expected range each will be in as the CVT does its thing. If the belt or clutch slips badly these go outside the expected parameters and the V light comes on as a warning. When we mess about with weights and/or clutches we also go outside these parameters which confuses the ECU.

I have 25g sliders and regularly ride with alacrity, two up, in lumpy territory so I have regular visits from the V light fairy. The only irritation is having to reset it on a regular basis, so I'm now reliant on my maintenance records for the next belt change 🙂
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Loosemarbles
Silver Wing Expert
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Loosemarbles

Number of posts : 575
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 12:28 pm

Well, as expected I went out this afternoon and all the lights worked as advertised. No problems.

Now that I think about it, this latest issue happened after the bike had been standing in the garage for about 6 days. Thinks......"was the battery discharging during that time"?

My SW never goes more than 2 or 3 days without a journey for some reason or other. Thinks..."not long enough for the battery to start discharging"?

Having learned more from the above I'll see whether my upcoming jobs will narrow things down.

1. New Dr Pulley Sliders and Sliding Pieces.

2. Have a good old Butcher's Hook at the pulleys and belt and also take a peek at the clutch drum and shoes.

3. Clean everything to within a micron of it's life.

If the problem reoccurs, new battery. I'll this topic with my findings Sleep









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bweighmaster
Scooter Rider
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Number of posts : 14
Location : Mission , Tx.
Points : 85
Registration date : 2020-11-17

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PostSubject: Disagree does'nt work like that . Nice train of thought though ..... It's a Reminder .. Only ...   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 1:46 pm

steve_h80 wrote:
bweighmaster wrote:
The V light comes on automaticly at 16 K intervals as a reminder only .. there are No sensors to indicate a belt problem Even if the belt breaks there are no indicators to tell the system there is a problem .. It is just a reminder light only .....

There isn't a sensor as such but there is the speedo that reads off the back wheel which gives one set of data to the ECU, the engine revs the other. Deep in its little silicon brain the ECU compares the two and the expected range each will be in as the CVT does its thing. If the belt or clutch slips badly these go outside the expected parameters and the V light comes on as a warning. When we mess about with weights and/or clutches we also go outside these parameters which confuses the ECU.

I have 25g sliders and regularly ride with alacrity, two up, in lumpy territory so I have regular visits from the V light fairy. The only irritation is having to reset it on a regular basis, so I'm now reliant on my maintenance records for the next belt change 🙂
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Loosemarbles
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Loosemarbles

Number of posts : 575
Location : South East England
Points : 2214
Registration date : 2016-10-01

Warning lights coming on Empty
PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 2:38 pm

Being just a reminder we would only see it at 16,000...32,000 miles? Connected to the odometer? I've only ever seen this light at those intervals so how can it come on intermittently?

Maybe there is a different ECU configuration with ages of SW. I have not been able to locate a service manual for the 2001 model and begin to wonder whether it was a prototype !!!...in which case I'm a development engineer....yay! I must remember to make sure Honda send me my fees. scratch

I wouldn't be surprised to find that my ECU is the size of a brick and has a floppy disk drive.
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bweighmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 2:43 pm

Only a reminder light .....
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oldwingguy
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeTue Nov 24, 2020 6:16 pm

Now that I think about it, this latest issue happened after the bike had been standing in the garage for about 6 days. Thinks......"was the battery discharging during that time"? <<>> if it's not charging it's discharging, put a good voltmeter on it and you will see. If you were closer I let you use my Battery Bug, a neat little tool to have.
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steve_h80
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Warning lights coming on Empty
PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 26, 2020 5:12 am

Loosemarbles wrote:

I wouldn't be surprised to find that my ECU is the size of a brick and has a floppy disk drive.

Ah, that means you've got one of the modern ones - mine uses punch cards.
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The Bern
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The Bern

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Warning lights coming on Empty
PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 26, 2020 9:20 am

Loosemarbles wrote:

Maybe there is a different ECU configuration with ages of SW. I have not been able to locate a service manual for the 2001 model and begin to wonder whether it was a prototype !!!...

No deffo not a prototype bud, I also had a 2001 model  Smile


If it helps, the sensor has 3 wires :-
Green/Black goes to a common earth (on frame)
Brown/Black goes to a common live feed from 10 amp middle fuse front box
Pink/Green  goes to terminal 17 on ECM, and VSP terminal of the meter CPU.

The link from the main ECM (terminal 5) to meter CPU is Pink/Orange.
There is no colour code for the wire from the meter CPU to the warning light, but presumably is Pink/Orange ?

So the 'clever stuff' happens in both main ECM & meter CPU, not only recording milage but also sensing any disparity between the preprogrammed relationship of engine rev's to road speed (belt slip,etc).

Can you tell I have a 2001 shop manual bud Wink study
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bweighmaster
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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 26, 2020 12:31 pm

Sorry , wrong .. ECU does not think ..
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The Bern
Silver Wing Expert
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The Bern

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Warning lights coming on Empty
PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 26, 2020 2:49 pm

bweighmaster wrote:
Sorry ,   wrong ..   ECU  does not think ..  

Really, gotta wonder what they are therefore then bud ???? please enlighten me what happens within the 'silicone brain'
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Loosemarbles
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Loosemarbles

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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 26, 2020 3:30 pm

The Bern's comments might reflect the V light issue and I'm getting to understand how that would work.

Lots of food for thought here. I'm convinced that the ECU has a great influence on proceedings.

From which planet did you acquire a 2001 manual?
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The Bern
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The Bern

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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeThu Nov 26, 2020 3:57 pm

Loosemarbles wrote:

From which planet did you acquire a 2001 manual?


Got it a while back from a Honda dealer bud, if you'd like to bid me on it (plus postage) with proceeds going to my local air ambulance, please do.
Near perfect condition, small tear to front cover (lower left corner) & a couple of notes inside & outside of rear cover, no greasey fingerprints on pages.

Available new here ... https://www.cmsnl.com/products/fjs6001_62mct00/#.X8AZwbOnzv8 .... obviously not execting that sort of money bud.
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Loosemarbles
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Loosemarbles

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PostSubject: Re: Warning lights coming on   Warning lights coming on I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 02, 2020 1:20 pm

Just as an update, the warning lights came on again today (the bike ran yesterday) and I 'think' that they came on as I pressed the starter switch, then went off in after a second.

I've got the battery tender in operation now Idea
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