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 WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!

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Skippy
Super Scooter Rider
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Skippy

Number of posts : 299
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Location : Exeter. Devon.
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PostSubject: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 26, 2010 5:01 pm

I would like to buy or borrow a genuine Honda workshop manual for our bikes - with the sole intention of reproducing it as a PDF for everyone to access and down load if they wish.

As far as I can tell these books are a rare commodity, but I have the time, where for all, and equipment necessary to achieve my aim. I also have the relevant micro fische.

Any help with this project would be greatly appreciated.
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bigbird
Silver Wing Guru
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Location : Winnipeg
Points : 6647
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 26, 2010 5:15 pm

x.


Last edited by bigbird on Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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exavid
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 2658
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Location : Medford, Oregon
Points : 7108
Registration date : 2009-07-17

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeFri Nov 26, 2010 10:57 pm

Helm Inc. is a good source for a service manual. A couple of Goldwing sites I know of have gotten 'cease and desist' letters from lawyers when posting major sections or complete .pdf's of Honda service manuals. Mother Honda spent a good bit of money to create the manuals and wants to get a bit of it back. Kinda like the RIAA but not as vicious.
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jdeereanton
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
jdeereanton

Number of posts : 1996
Age : 73
Location : Huntsville, AL
Points : 6595
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 5:48 am

The manual is copyrighted and as such is intellectual property. I and others have posted snippets from the manual here and I am always a bit cautious about even doing that.

Reproducing the manual in whole or part for distribution (even if not for profit) without permission is theft. There are some fair use exceptions, like the snippets you may find here at times. Do they all meet legal scrutiny - probably not.

I'd very much like to see us have this ability, but then I also know how many resources are required (time, talent, and $) to create a maintenance manual and can respect Honda's need to recover that investment.
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john grinsel
Curmudgeon
john grinsel

Number of posts : 3052
Age : 82
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 6:01 am

Better to buy one---every new bike deal includes a shop manual for that bike.

If it saves one screw up....paid for its self.

Copy without permission, not good idea. Book is available thru Honda Dealers.

John Grinsel
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MikeO
Site Admin
MikeO

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Location : Seaham, Co Durham, UK
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 6:33 am

Is it not already on line?

The Piaggio ones are.
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jdeereanton
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
jdeereanton

Number of posts : 1996
Age : 73
Location : Huntsville, AL
Points : 6595
Registration date : 2008-12-24

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 7:24 am

The SilverWing Shop Manual is (as far as I know) not accessible on-line. The Illustrated Parts Books are out there in various formats and especially on vendor sites, but the service (shop) manual is not.

There are some (questionable) vendors that pop up in various locations on the internet that sell copied copyrighted material and you can occasionally find the service manual. Other than dealerships and an occasional individual who is selling a legal manual, Helm Inc seems to be the only authorized vendor selling the manual.
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Skippy
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider
Skippy

Number of posts : 299
Age : 54
Location : Exeter. Devon.
Points : 4277
Registration date : 2010-08-18

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 9:06 am

Hmm, will have to take a closer look at the details raised by this. My webmaster in the UK CX owners club has created a fantastic system linked to 'fische' for the supply of parts (rather on the same lines that CMS NL use) and we did have a club member who started to create a website of 'how to's' and 'jobs I've done' - unfortuantely, while he was enthusiastic he wasn't an engineering type and lacked certain basic knowledge; couple that with an ego and the inability to accept positive criteque and you ended up with the whole issue getting binned.

Perhaps, to avoid legal complications, this might be the way to go? To create a database of members achievements/work completed on their bikes?? I know for a fact that both my wheels need to be refinished as the coating is starting to flake off - something that I'm well able to deal with and document. I'll use this as a trial run.

As JD and others have done in the past, Honda cannot complain about 'referencing' workshop manuals as long as its not half a book Smile
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jdeereanton
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
jdeereanton

Number of posts : 1996
Age : 73
Location : Huntsville, AL
Points : 6595
Registration date : 2008-12-24

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 9:10 am

There is a section of How To - https://www.silverwing600.com/pictorials-how-to-perform-maintenance-f21/

And you are welcome to post in that section. Maybe we could use a bit of an index...
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Skippy
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider
Skippy

Number of posts : 299
Age : 54
Location : Exeter. Devon.
Points : 4277
Registration date : 2010-08-18

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 9:25 am

Should've know you'd all be one step a head of me Dale Smile

I'll have look and with 'authors' permission perhaps look into indexing it in some way. It seems a great start anyway.

Hope you all have recovered from your OD of turkey by the way :lol!:
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pancho
Super Scooter Rider
Super Scooter Rider
pancho

Number of posts : 220
Age : 65
Location : Brownsville Texas
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 9:37 am

I just bought one on E-Bay for 25.00,not bad. I have seen other forums get in trouble in posting them. Just my 2.
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Sweendog
Maxi-Scooter Rider
Maxi-Scooter Rider
Sweendog

Number of posts : 154
Location : South New Jersey
Points : 4490
Registration date : 2009-07-12

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 11:20 am

You'd be breaking copyright law (at least in the US) by posting a complete copy of the shop manual on line. The manuals aren't that hard to find for reasonable prices on Ebay, and you can get most of the answers you need from this fine community. Having said that, I think it's worth shelling out the $20-40 to have a local copy on-hand. =)

As far as parts fiches go, there are multiple decent sites on line that offer a full parts fiche for pretty much every model year of bike. I don't believe Honda copy writes the parts fiche, but if they do, the parts dealers must have some kind of agreement to let them have searchable links on-line. I use Ron Ayer's site, because they've been a cheap, reliable source for parts the few (3) times I've used them. There are many other sites that have a searchable fiche though, including at several in the UK, France, and Germany. I imagine there are sites to be found in most other countries as well.
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Guest
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 12:45 pm

You can find the service manual at amazon. This Link will take you there. The price is $60.00 USD. It's for 2002 to 2009 models. Since it's on Amazon.com I would have to assume it's legit.
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joncallihan
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 1025
Age : 83
Location : Lafayette, Colorado, USA
Points : 5642
Registration date : 2009-02-16

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSat Nov 27, 2010 9:26 pm

World of Powersports is a reseller of Helm -- it's legit.
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tinman
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 1299
Age : 72
Location : Matheson, Ontario, Canada
Points : 4841
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSun Dec 04, 2011 1:28 am

I pictup a service manual for my 09 they gave me a 15% discont
I payed $ 127. 00 with taxes
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bikerboy
Silver Wing Rider
Silver Wing Rider


Number of posts : 400
Age : 77
Location : Leyland England
Points : 4076
Registration date : 2011-05-12

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeSun Dec 04, 2011 6:29 am

Honda no longer sell manuals in the UK, they are all on-line and available to official dealers only. As I posted elsewhere, Helm wanted an incredible price to send on to me, I assume that it must weigh a ton as most of the cost was delivery !!
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bikerboy
Silver Wing Rider
Silver Wing Rider


Number of posts : 400
Age : 77
Location : Leyland England
Points : 4076
Registration date : 2011-05-12

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 5:21 am

I have now bought a manual from www.RepairManual.com. It was a good price, US$80 posted to the UK, only took a few days and the customs did not get involved. I note that it is the 2002-2008 book with several sets of stickers to bring the dates to 2002-2011 so nothing has changed on the bike. Obviously HondaSan got everything sorted from the get-go and there has been no need to change anything !!!
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Dimond
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Dimond

Number of posts : 540
Age : 76
Location : San Francisco Bay Area
Points : 4243
Registration date : 2011-08-07

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 8:12 am

I purchased my service manual from a NewYork City supplier:


http://store03.prostores.com/servlet/manualwizard/Categories

manualwizard1970@yahoo.com
Riggs kwong
41 Clara Street
Brooklyn, NY 11218-3009

They do international shipments - but you would need to ask about the cost. My manual, with shipping to California, was $30 (delivered). Mr Kwong was very responsive regarding any query and kept me advised of shipping date, etc. - felt like I was buying something worth thousands. I was very reluctant to shell out $70 for a pile of paper - a very important pile of paper - but for $30 I could justify making the plunge. The manual was well bound, complete for what I needed, and it has served me well so far. If you are going to do just about ANY repair/maintenance on your Silverwing you would be well advised to get a manual (from someone) as it is well laid out and has a wealth of information on how Honda believes you should effect your repairs; however, you should couple this manual with the advice given within this forum (and/or other forums) as the combination will let you tackle most any repair with confidence. I have a 2003 SWing and so far have not found any area where this manual does not seem to match my bike. It takes a lot of the mystery out of what lurks beneath the plastic with a multitude of pictorials and step-by-steps for taking things apart and for getting them back together. For 'beginner' mechanics, such as myself, this manual helps - but there are invariably steps missing - which is where this forum is invaluable. The cover of this manual states "2002-2009 61MCT07" and inside it states "Date of Issue: October 2007". My GUESS is that NOT EVERYTHING is going to be covered if you have a 2008 and later model year (IMHO). It has torque values for every screw and bolt on the bike - my bike was previously maintained by dealer mechanics and most bolts/nuts were waaaaay overtorqued. As BigBid says (in summary), 'get a manual AND read it'. Is there a copyright page in this manual? What do you think? Am I glad to have purchased this manual from this vendor? You Bet!
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bikerboy
Silver Wing Rider
Silver Wing Rider


Number of posts : 400
Age : 77
Location : Leyland England
Points : 4076
Registration date : 2011-05-12

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 2:14 pm

There was also a small sticker to update the part number which is now 61MCT09
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Daboo
Super Scooter Rider
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Daboo

Number of posts : 271
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 2:43 pm

I seriously doubt Manual Wizard is selling a legal copy. When I look at the picture of the manual for the Burgman 400, I can see a black edge to where the binding has been formed. The factory service manual I have in the garage that was purchased from the dealership, does not have that. It appears they have done something similar to what the OP was trying to do...they have taken a service manual apart, photocopied the pages...except they are printing it off to resell.

On BurgmanUSA, we've asked Suzuki about this and the reply is that they only sell the factory service manual from Suzuki dealerships. When we see a link to Manual Wizard, or any other online vendor, we delete it.

Here's the text we add when replacing the links to illegal copies of the service manual.
Quote :
Edit by moderator - Since the forums are "moderated", Burgman USA doesn't have Safe Harbor Protection provided by the Digital Millennium Copyright Act of 1998 and we have to be very careful about what is allowed on the forums. The links to the manuals and microfiche were removed as they contained links to copyrighted materials.

Chris
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tinman
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 1299
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 7:42 pm

Here in Canada the only way to get a honda shop and service manual is through a Honda dealer, and they are not cheap . My 750 Shadow was $ 117.00 10 years go . my Silverwing was $138.00 less 15%.+ taxes.
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bigbird
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 2413
Location : Winnipeg
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 7:44 pm

x


Last edited by bigbird on Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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tinman
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru


Number of posts : 1299
Age : 72
Location : Matheson, Ontario, Canada
Points : 4841
Registration date : 2011-11-29

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeWed Apr 04, 2012 7:50 pm

At the time I did not know that they could come from the US I tried to get one from Coles book store and they could not get them .
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bikerboy
Silver Wing Rider
Silver Wing Rider


Number of posts : 400
Age : 77
Location : Leyland England
Points : 4076
Registration date : 2011-05-12

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeThu Apr 05, 2012 1:08 pm

Helm wanted an arm and a leg to ship UK. No problem with RepairManual.
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Dimond
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Dimond

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeThu Apr 05, 2012 2:58 pm

I asked ManualWizard what they would charge for DELIVERED SWing 61MCT07 service manual and if they ever had delivery problems - this was their response:
START OF QUOTE
"For orders within the USA >> $30 delivered.

All international orders are $37 delivered, air mail parcel post, duty free.

They may buy through my web stores:
http://store03.prostores.com/servlet/manualwizard/StoreFront
www.sell.com/selling/cholocholo41/

I ship to the UK, Australia, New Zealand quite often. Not a single problem. Italy, Africa and South America takes 30 days for delivery despite the package leaving my office the following day after payment is received - it's customs enforcement, out of my control.

Overall no problems or lost packages." END OFQUOTE
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Waspie
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
Waspie

Number of posts : 2392
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeFri May 11, 2012 5:55 am

Dimond wrote:
I asked ManualWizard what they would charge for DELIVERED SWing 61MCT07 service manual and if they ever had delivery problems - this was their response:
START OF QUOTE
"For orders within the USA >> $30 delivered.

All international orders are $37 delivered, air mail parcel post, duty free.

They may buy through my web stores:
http://store03.prostores.com/servlet/manualwizard/StoreFront
www.sell.com/selling/cholocholo41/

I ship to the UK, Australia, New Zealand quite often. Not a single problem. Italy, Africa and South America takes 30 days for delivery despite the package leaving my office the following day after payment is received - it's customs enforcement, out of my control.

Overall no problems or lost packages." END OFQUOTE

If the person wanting a manual is in the UK or Europe, they may wist to pay a bit more and get the manual for their specific variant. The links you supply are for the USA FSC model whereas the UK/Europe models are FSJ. There are some subtle differences in electrics and security. The UK versions have the HISS as standard.

Just inputting so that folk unfamiliar are aware there are differences in the models. Smile
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Dimond
Silver Wing Expert
Silver Wing Expert
Dimond

Number of posts : 540
Age : 76
Location : San Francisco Bay Area
Points : 4243
Registration date : 2011-08-07

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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeFri May 11, 2012 8:25 am

Waspie wrote:


If the person wanting a manual is in the UK or Europe, they may wist to pay a bit more and get the manual for their specific variant. The links you supply are for the USA FSC model whereas the UK/Europe models are FSJ. There are some subtle differences in electrics and security. The UK versions have the HISS as standard.

Just inputting so that folk unfamiliar are aware there are differences in the models. Smile


Very important clarification Waspie - thanks for this input.
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Waspie
Silver Wing Guru
Silver Wing Guru
Waspie

Number of posts : 2392
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Location : Portland, UK
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PostSubject: Re: WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All!   WANTED - Workshop Manual - For the Good of All! I_icon_minitimeFri May 11, 2012 9:01 am

Dimond it doesn't matter to me!! I own a FSC manual and own an FSJ machine as I won't be getting THAT involved in the repair of my Wing. But the purists may purchase thinking it will have the wiring for the HISS and in fact it doesn't. Or similar. Rolling Eyes

A manual no matter what variant it is for is worth the money just to remove panels and the like. That function alone could in fact pay for itself. Laughing
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