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 Suspending Scooter from Winch

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Steve Danzinger
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Number of posts : 14
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PostSubject: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 2:42 pm

I'd like to use my winch in my garage to Raise my scooter to a comfortable height to service, clean and wax my scooter. I'm confident I can support the back end from the two hand grips on each side of the passenger seat. What might I use for the front end? Can the handlebar grips handle that load? Any other idea's scratch
Thanks, Steve D.
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 3:05 pm

Steve, old buddy. I like your enthusiasm... But that sounds like a disaster in the making. But remember... It's all fixable with time and money for parts.

Unless it falls on you, then it's money for parts and time to heal...then do the repairs.

Good luck and be careful.
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dekare
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 3:06 pm

[quote="Steve Danzinger"]I'd like to use my winch in my garage to Raise my scooter to a comfortable height to service, clean and wax my scooter. I'm confident I can support the back end from the two hand grips on each side of the passenger seat. What might I use for the front end? Can the handlebar grips handle that load? Any other idea's scratch
Thanks, Steve D.[/quotE

Keep in mind those handles are kind of a pot metal. They should handle it, but who knows for sure.
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 3:07 pm

I'm kind of sure that the bars will bend if you try to suspend the scoot from the hand grips. They have been known to bend when using Canyon Dancers to tie secure the bike for transport. And they're simply used to keep the bike from moving about --not support the full weight.

However if you remove the handle bar cover(s) you might have success in suspending the scoot from the central point of the handle bar mount. 

Once raised I'd sure use a milk crate under the front wheel to support the weight though.

Tim
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 3:33 pm

Why not just buy a bike lift----they are resonable at Harbor Freight.
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Steve Danzinger
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 3:51 pm

Hey guys, keep in mind we're only talking about less than 150lbs. at each suspension point. I'll let you know how things work out.
Thanks,
Steve D
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 4:01 pm

Don't do it.
The frame is not designed to take that kind of load from the pillion bars, too many potential points of failure.
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Steve Danzinger
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 5:30 pm

Silver Wing Guru: I really don't want to take up the space of lift. It's so seldom I'll have the bike on a lift, I'd have to have a place to store the lift when not in use.
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Easyrider
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 5:31 pm

Steve,
Don't do it! The handlebars will not take the load. That is why it is not recommended to secure the Swing by the handlebars as tie down points when transporting the Swing. If you are planning to lift your bike high enough to get under it, then you should get a lift as John mentioned. I would love to have a HF motorcycle lift, but the freight charges would be too much for me.
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Modernman1953
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Number of posts : 378
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 05, 2016 6:18 pm

I used a set of straps on the handlebars to keep the bike's weight on the rear wheel, while I took the front wheel off of the bike.  That action is not lifting the bike as it is using the center stand as a pivot point and ensuring that the weight of the bike is on the rear wheels.  

Raising the bike to work on with a winch is probably not a good idea if you are going to raise it with the handle bars.  

Using 3 milk crates and a 2x10 board will get it up off the ground to work on.  Using another 2x10 as a ramp you can roll the bike up the ramp onto the 2x10.  Using straps to the ceiling you can steady the bike to work on it while it is on the self made strand.  If you have a front wheel chock, so much the better and use straps off the rear passenger grab bars.   All of that busy stuff.............. you are going to need a buddy to help.
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeWed Dec 07, 2016 10:04 pm

If I were to lift a maxi with a winch I'd definitely want to lift from the frame, not an accessory. If you can get a reliable hook point on the frame near the rear and attach to the frame head at the front those points ought to be strong enough.
The real risk isn't in lifting the bike it's working under or very close to it while it's suspended. I've hoisted some pretty heavy motorcycles to load or unload from my truck but I sure wouldn't work under one. Removing parts from a hanging load like that will change the balance point. Removing a rear wheel requires a good bit of torque on the axle which could upset the load. Working under or very near a suspended load doesn't give much time or warning to get out of the way if something gives way. You don't want to be the meat in the sandwich.
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Mike from NS
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 7:24 am

Don't do it Steve!   We can get into enough trouble, when least expected, when simply riding.  Suspending a S'Wing is looking for trouble which should be expected.  I'm in complete agreement with steve_h80 and Easyrider.  Likely you would be working alone and if something were to happen, you may end up learning why this was not a good idea.

But if you do hoist the bike ... please let us know how it went; with pictures for added interest.

Be safe!
Mike
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oldwingguy
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 8:51 am

Once hanging every push pull tug or nudge will have it moving more than you would think. I used a 4x8 sheet of plywood with a chainfall to put my inflatable Sea Eagle boat on to get it up off the floor. Great idea it works but I still had to tie it off with " mooring lines " to keep it from swinging around. A HF lift for the S'Wing is safest for that S'Wing AND you.
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Silver Dave K
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 11:57 am

Wouldn't be the safest thing you've ever done!
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gremlin
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Number of posts : 227
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 2:35 pm

Mike from NS wrote:
Don't do it Steve!  

But if you do hoist the bike  ... please let us know how it went; with pictures for added interest.

Be safe!
Mike

A video would be better, so we can see when exactly it drops on you and what the consequences are jocolor
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steve_h80
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Number of posts : 486
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 2:59 pm

Are you still with us SteveD?
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Steve Danzinger
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Number of posts : 14
Location : Louisville, KY
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 3:27 pm

I'm trying to post a sketch but I'm not having any luck.
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Steve Danzinger
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Number of posts : 14
Location : Louisville, KY
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 3:33 pm

Can someone tell me how to post a picture to this forum?
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Steve Danzinger
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Number of posts : 14
Location : Louisville, KY
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 3:50 pm

scratch I tried posting a sketch of my plan for a lifting rig and a "sawhorse" style base to rest the bike on. However I'm not savvy enough to get it posted. You'd think a guy who designs on a CAD could figure out how to attach a photo or sketch!

SteveD
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Easyrider
Silver Wing Expert
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 3:58 pm

Steve Danzinger wrote:
scratch I tried posting a sketch of my plan for a lifting rig and a "sawhorse" style base to rest the bike on. However I'm not savvy enough to get it posted. You'd think a guy who designs on a CAD could figure out how to attach a photo or sketch!

SteveD
Steve,
Use the search feature in this forum. Use search argument of "pictures". That should get you there. The posts that I saw were for computers with keyboard. Some instructions refer to "right key" and had to guess with my tablet. Good luck.
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Modernman1953
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Number of posts : 378
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 8:41 pm

Steve Danzinger wrote:
Can someone tell me how to post a picture to this forum?

One has to host the picture elsewhere and then link to it.  Photobucket works.  I have linked from a Facebook post as well.

This picture is copied from a Goldwing Forum but is actually linked from Photobucket:

Suspending Scooter from Winch 100_1290_zps031e55f5
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gremlin
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gremlin

Number of posts : 227
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeThu Dec 08, 2016 9:04 pm

Steve Danzinger wrote:
Can someone tell me how to post a picture to this forum?

Click onto the icon: Host an image
Select an image file
Send the image to the selected category
Copy the url in the top line
Click onto the icon: insert image
Paste the url which you have copied and click insert
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exavid
Silver Wing Guru
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeSun Dec 11, 2016 9:15 pm

You can host your own pictures. Using the first picture option (Host an Image) on the top of the message block when posting, you simply put the file from your own computer in the box. The picture can't be much larger than 250K. The picture of my lift was about 56k bytes.
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Steve Danzinger
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Number of posts : 14
Location : Louisville, KY
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 12, 2016 12:23 pm

Suspending Scooter from Winch Bike_r13

fOR THOSE WHO WERE INTERESTED IN HOW I PLAN TO SUSPEND MY SWING FOR SERVICE AND OTHER NECESSARY MAINTENANCE, SEE ATTACHED DRAWING. ANY COMMENTS LET ME KNOW.

THANKS
STEVE D
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Mike from NS
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 12, 2016 7:25 pm

Thanks for sharing your thoughts through your sketch Steve.  Not quite sure where you intend to attach the lifting chain near the front.  I recall you felt the grab handles for the passenger were suitable attachments points near the rear.   Be extremely cautious in doing this. I'm sure that this application wasn't built into the design of these handles nor into their attachment to the bike. Make sure you have all the strength of materials data and calculate the lifting strength of each element of your arrangement, including that of the handles and bolts to the frame.  Once something cracks or is over loaded to the point of failure, the only thing that will stop a tragedy, that being the falling bike,  is the surface to which the bike will fall.   I maintain my earlier comment .. don't do it Steve.
Mike

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Steve Danzinger
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 12, 2016 7:45 pm

Thanks for the input Mike, I plan on checking the attachment points carefully and will keep your concerns in mind. I still contend that the total weight of 600 lbs. and using 4 lifting points I'm looking at 150lbs. at each point. That doesn't seem like that much of a burden per point.
Steve D
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Mike from NS
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 12, 2016 8:41 pm

Your plan, Steve, is for each lifting point to lift 150#. But if a leg of the saw-horse fails or collapses, you may very suddenly be looking at one lifting point "seeing" 600# instantaneously. Each lifting point and the attachment to the bike should be designed for at least 600# and more likely 1.5x the total weight. Even that is light and 2X and better yet 3X the total weight for each lifting point would be a better consideration. All depends on how safe you like to be. And at that, the additional load developed through impulse and momentum forces should be considered, in case suddenly something slips and the bike begins moving or "s'wings", .

Pretty sure none of the locations you have considered for lifting have been designed for that application. The industry standard is to lift the bike when on a surface rather than from a frame member with a hoist from above.

Yup .. don't do it Steve.
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gremlin
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeMon Dec 12, 2016 9:50 pm

Steve Danzinger wrote:
Silver Wing Guru: I really don't want to take up the space of lift. It's so seldom I'll have the bike on a lift, I'd have to have a place to store the lift when not in use.

Use your planned winch / pulley set up to lift the motorbike lift out of the way. cherry
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steve_h80
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 2:28 am

Is this a leading up to a Darwin award?
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Mike from NS
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 9:13 am

steve_h80 wrote:
Is this a leading up to a Darwin award?

I hope not .... doesn't the recipient have to be dead? This is why we are cautioning Steve not to do it.
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Steve Danzinger
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 9:40 am

Ok enough said. Thanks for your concerns and when I've completed my project I'll be sure it will be safe and not near as dangerous as riding the bike on public roadways.

Steve D.
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Jolly Bodger
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 11:46 am

Sword of Damocles comes to mind affraid

JB
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 1:20 pm

I hope it works well. We don't need another way to 'drop' a bike.
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 3:02 pm

Even though I have had lift for over 30 years I sometimes still lay on floor to work on bike. Reason: Old, the effort involved in getting up=better than going to gym. Most need the exercise.
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Meldrew
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 5:12 pm

I'm an old git, and getting down on the garage floor occasionally to do a bit of maintenance or tyre checks makes more sense than cluttering up the place with an expensive hydraulic bench/lift thing I'd rarely use. Or heaven forbid, dream up a winch contraption that resembles the thing hospitals use to get patients in and out of the bath.

I also go to the gym five mornings a week, it's a regular daily routine which I don't mind doing, and I pay to get down on the floor there.
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oldwingguy
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PostSubject: Re: Suspending Scooter from Winch   Suspending Scooter from Winch I_icon_minitimeTue Dec 13, 2016 5:30 pm

I pay to get down on the floor there. >>>> LOL, take the S'Wing along and get a twofer, exercise and maintenance. Laughing
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