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 WTB Dr Pulley Sliders

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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 10 Aug 2016, 16:11

Anybody have a set of 26gm Dr Pulley Sliders for sale? PM me.

Tim
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Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 17 Aug 2016, 13:57

No, I don't have what you are looking for; however, I do have a question I'm sure you can answer.

First, are Sliders really more efficient than Rollers? And, what weight (of either type) gives lower RPM at highway speeds, and, conversely, faster acceleration from a stop to highway speeds?

Knowing that you can't have the best of both worlds, what is the best weight to achieve the optimum of each?

Thanks,

Tom
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 17 Aug 2016, 14:13

Sliders are more efficient. OEM rollers are 28gm and switching to 28gm sliders will give improved performance, smoother operation (relative to OEM rollers) and lower RPMs at cruising speeds. 21gm sliders will give a whopping improvement in accelleration at the expense of fuel efficiency as well as top speed. That said, can you really notice the difference between 115mph and 100mph? So a good compromise would fall somewhere between the 21 & 28gm sliders.

Tim
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Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 17 Aug 2016, 14:29

Thanks for the immediate reply.

So, Tim, as I am not into Drag Racing or taunting the Harley guys, would you suggest 28 gram sliders, not rollers, for best and improved, all around performance. yes?

While I'm at it, what are your thoughts on installing a J. Costa Variator?

Thanks again,

Tom
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DennisB
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 17 Aug 2016, 15:08

Hey Tom,

The J. Costa Variator, what a blast!!! A lot of us that have been involved with this scooter for a time installed a J. Costa Variator. I still have mine in a box in the garage.

Positive: Great off the line acceleration. WOW!!! affraid

Negatives: Gas mileage drops, Variator light keeps coming on from over reeving, Belt life goes south much sooner, plates wear faster.

In short it's a lot fun for a short time and it wears out fast and is expensive to maintain.
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janitorj1
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 17 Aug 2016, 15:45

Can someone post a pic of the difference between a "roller" and a "slider"? So I want to buy a set of 28 gm sliders - where? Thanks all.

Everything is cool on my swing, but sliders seem intriguing. Simple enough job I presume...

Jon
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Silver Dave K
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Wed 17 Aug 2016, 17:04

I have a J Costa with a few thousand miles on it. I'd let it go for 1/2 price of a new one plus shipping.... Dave
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Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Thu 18 Aug 2016, 06:12

DennisB wrote:
Hey Tom,

The J. Costa Variator, what a blast!!! A lot of us that have been involved with this scooter for a time installed a J. Costa Variator. I still have mine in a box in the garage.

Positive: Great off the line acceleration. WOW!!! affraid

Negatives: Gas mileage drops, Variator light keeps coming on from over reeving, Belt life goes south much sooner, plates wear faster.

In short it's a lot fun for a short time and it wears out fast and is expensive to maintain.


Can't recall if I replied or not; anyway, thanks a lot for the info. No J. Costa for me. Sounds good on paper, but higher maintenance and replacement feature is not for me.
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Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Thu 18 Aug 2016, 06:14

Silver Dave K wrote:
I have a J Costa with a few thousand miles on it. I'd let it go for 1/2 price of a new one plus shipping.... Dave


Thanks Dave, but I'll pass. What is your reason(s) for not using the J. Costa?

Same as Dennis B's?
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The Scootist
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Thu 18 Aug 2016, 09:35

When I bought my 2007 Swing it came with the OEM rollers.  I installed a J Costa variator and was thrilled with the improved acceleration and smoother feel, but after only about 10,000 miles it was showing a lot of wear on the plates and the variator light came on frequently, so I replaced the J Costa with the OEM variator but installed 26g sliders.  This worked very well, but I missed the quicker acceleration I had with the J Costa, especially when riding in the mountains, so when I got my 2009 Swing I installed 22g sliders.  These give me nearly the same acceleration as the J Costa, but overall I get better fuel economy.  With the 22g sliders, I have lost a little off the top end.  I used to be able to register 115 on the speedometer, and now it seems to top out at about 106, but since I never ride at that speed, the loss of top end isn't an issue.  The real benefit is when riding in the mountains, the 22g sliders allow the engine to immediately jump into the power band when I need to accelerate up a hill or pass someone.  I usually try to keep my revs at or less than 5,000 rpms and if I do I will get between 50 and 55 mpg.  The worst fuel economy I get are on those occasions when I ride with a lot of hard acceleration, and even then, I will still get 48 mpg.
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Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Thu 18 Aug 2016, 14:51

Thanks for the info. Next belt change it will be 22g sliders for me.
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Easyrider
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 02:00

Tom,
I experimented with 26, then 24gm sliders. I settled on the 24gm sliders for the off line response, and 500 RPM less at about 60MPH. I get around 50 MPG(US). Well worth the money. Good luck with your choice. Maybe others that went with the 22gm sliders will give their impressions.
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Davefirestorm
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 02:43

Interesting thread,my SW is just past 15k miles and I reckon I'll be using Dr.P 26g sliders with a new belt.But where in UK can I buy set or do I buy from States?
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Old Limey
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 04:14

If you want Dr Pulley sliders in the UK go to Dr Pulley.com I think they come from Germany but you can choose the weight of sliders you want. I got 26grm for my last Silver wing and for my present one. They are about fifty pound.
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 04:42

Wotcha Dave, as Old Limey says Germany,  
26 gram link ... http://drpulley.shopnix.de/product_info.php?products_id=572

Other weights available see ... http://drpulley.shopnix.de/index.php?cPath=47_58


Link corrected Embarassed , many thanks to Cosmic Jumper for being 'on the ball' Smile


Last edited by The Bern on Fri 19 Aug 2016, 08:54; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Removed incorrect link & added right one)
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 04:54

Thanks for that you two,so I just swap these sliders with the stock rollers and away we go lol? New belt needed too is the Honda one best or is there an alternative favoured?
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 06:02

Old Limey & myself are both using Gates belt from Wemoto
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 07:26

The Bern wrote:
Wotcha Dave, as Old Limey says Germany, direct link for 26 gram .... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Variomatic-Weight-17-0g-Dr-Pulley-26-x-13mm-set-A-8-pieces-442959-/272307366500?hash=item3f66c8aa64:g:NCMAAOSwygJXh1m-

Other weights available see ... http://drpulley.shopnix.de/index.php?cPath=47_58

Bern, the first link to eBay is NOT for Silverwing sliders. It appears that they are for some Suzuki models. The measurements for Dr Pulley S'Wing sliders are 28 x 20 x (chosen weight).

The second link to the Dr Pulley Shop in Germany does show the slider options available for S'Wings.

Tim
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Retired
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 07:41

I just picked up a set from BPNW  Dr Pulley slider  28-20 26g (503-860-7250) talked to Mike
For $54.95 plus shipping chickendance
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Mike from NS
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 07:42

The Bern wrote:
Old Limey & myself are both using Gates belt from Wemoto

Would you "post" the Gates belt number please? I looked at the Wemoto site hoping to find the number -- but no luck.
Thanks.
Mike
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 07:51

I went with the Honda belt I bought on EBay for $117 plus shipping
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 08:15

Cosmic_Jumper wrote:
The Bern wrote:
Wotcha Dave, as Old Limey says Germany, direct link for 26 gram .... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Variomatic-Weight-17-0g-Dr-Pulley-26-x-13mm-set-A-8-pieces-442959-/272307366500?hash=item3f66c8aa64:g:NCMAAOSwygJXh1m-

Bern, the first link to eBay is NOT for Silverwing sliders. It appears that they are for some Suzuki models. The measurements for Dr Pulley S'Wing sliders are 28 x 20 x (chosen weight).



Tim

Right you are Tim, Not sure how I managed that Embarassed Embarassed  correct link for 26 grams is .... http://drpulley.shopnix.de/product_info.php?products_id=572

Edit : Correct link & a thankyou added to original post, well spotted Tim


Last edited by The Bern on Fri 19 Aug 2016, 08:57; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : as noted)
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 08:20

Mike from NS wrote:
The Bern wrote:
Old Limey & myself are both using Gates belt from Wemoto

Would you "post" the Gates belt number please?  I looked at the Wemoto site hoping to find the number -- but no luck.
Thanks.
Mike


No prob's, just need to go & find my WSM



EDIT : And he's back Smile

Gates part # 9802-41804

I did post this a while back & IIRC it was Bigbird that researched it & found that Gates outlets in the USA did not stock it, due to lack of demand or something similar, however that situation may have changed since


Last edited by The Bern on Fri 19 Aug 2016, 08:32; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : as noted)
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 09:12

Davefirestorm wrote:
Thanks for that you two,so I just swap these sliders with the stock rollers and away we go lol?

You will need a method of preventing the variator from rotating, see here for a homemade locking tool .... http://www.silverwing600.com/t8590-new-belt-and-variator-tool

You will also need a torque wrench for the centre nut ..
76 Lb Ft / 103 N.m / 10.5kg m

While you've got it in bit's, there's a dust filter at the front of the outer cover, blow it clean, obviously blow dust out of the casing & there is a clutch shaft support bearing at the rear of the casing, give it a dollop of grease.
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Fri 19 Aug 2016, 09:25

Couple of video's that may help you ...





Think this one is Bigbird working on another members scoot'




Ohi if you go for a Gates there are no direction of rotation arrows, set it so you can read the name Wink
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Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sat 20 Aug 2016, 08:02

The Bern wrote:
Couple of video's that may help you ...





Think this one is Bigbird working on another members scoot'




Ohi if you go for a  Gates there are no direction of rotation arrows, set it so you can read the name Wink

Hello Bern,

Your video on belt replacement is absolutely excellent. I've replaced my belt several times, and still learned several important tips from your video.

Thank you

By the way, you mentioned that the nut holding the variator is 17mm. For some reason I though it was larger. I ask because when I take a long trip I like to include the socket that fits that nut. Please confirm that if you will. I had a 2002, and now have a 2013.

Again, thank you for everything you show me (us).

Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sat 20 Aug 2016, 09:11

Hi Tom, neither of those you tube video's was made by me, I'm not certain of the socket size myself either, it's been some time since I changed my own one.
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sat 20 Aug 2016, 09:27

Thanks Bern,

Perhaps someone else out there in "Honda Land" knows, Yes?

The question is: What is the size of the nut that holds the Silver Wing Variator?

I thought it was a 24mm nut, but the video that Bern's posted suggests 17mm.

Please reply if you know.

P.S. I'm to lazy to remove the covers to find out, and I want to carry the correct socket with me.

Thanks.

Tom G
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sat 20 Aug 2016, 11:55

Davefirestorm, I do use the Gates belt the first one I got from Wemoto, but, the last one was from  somewhere else. If you put Gates Drive belts on EBay search, suppliers will come up. Just one point, direction of travel does not matter with the gates belt.
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sat 20 Aug 2016, 19:17

Tom G wrote:
Thanks Bern,

Perhaps someone else out there in "Honda Land" knows, Yes?

The question is:  What is the size of the nut that holds the Silver Wing Variator?

I thought it was a 24mm nut, but the video that Bern's posted suggests 17mm.

Please reply if you know.

P.S.  I'm to lazy to remove the covers to find out, and I want to carry the correct socket with me.

Thanks.

Tom G


It indeed is a bolt that requires a 17mm socket.
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The Bern
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sun 21 Aug 2016, 06:13

Yep, as sctr says ^^^ 17mm, can't possibly be 24mm as that size socket is to large to pass throuh the hole in my variator locking plate ...


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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sun 21 Aug 2016, 06:49

Bern, What is that Special Tool you've made? The 3rd & 4th pics shown on your Photobucket page. A bolt with a grease fitting, hmm... scratch

Tim
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Sun 21 Aug 2016, 08:03

Hi Tim, I was gonna post about that, the bolt is the lean stand pivot, when I was doing a 'lube' service the stand was a bit stiff, on stripping there was a fine layer of dry dirt on the pin & the hole in the stand. So I cross drilled it then drilled down the centre, tapped & fitted a grease nipple.
Which then lead onto the logical extension of how to grease the pivot points of the centrestand (blurred picture), I had a dig through my 'odds 'n sods' box & found a couple of press fit nipples, a bit fiddly to do as there is not a lot of metal to work with, now at Autumn & Spring services two shots in each with the grease gun & the job's a good 'un Smile
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Mon 22 Aug 2016, 00:12

FWIW my first CVT mod on my new to me '06 S/W, as I was familiar with running DRP sliders on my '400 Burgman, was to install 26 g sliders--I was happy with the performance gain but there is always room for more so I ordered and installed a set of 22 g sliders.

What I found was that though initial acceleration was better it was not as improved as anticipated as the WOT rpms off-the-line climbed to 6400 or so--beyond what my 70 year-old, calibrated and re-calibrated for over 50 years, butt dyno tells me is the engine's peak torque band of 4500 to 5500 rpm. In fact pulling power between 40 and 55 mph seemed less than with the 26 g sliders or OEM rollers. Engine rpm at an indicated 70 mph (63 mph actual) was just under 5200 and it cost 3 to 4 mpg in my normal driving (I live "out in the county" and it's 10 to 12 miles of 65 to 70 mph to get anywhere)

So I opened it up again and loaded (4) 22 g and (4) 26 g (overall the same mass as eight 24 g) sliders. This combo revs to 5500 at WOT startup and seems to be delivering all the engine has. Engine speed at 70 indicated is just over 5000, first tank fuel economy indicates I got back 1-2 mpg; though that is not a major concern. My other set of "wheels", a '96 SL500, gets 15 to 17 mpg on a good day; it's one of those "passes most anything but a gas station" vehicles.

If asked I would recommend 24 g sliders for the 600 S'wing.

Next project is to play with increasing the torque multiplier spring preload. I had good results improving both initial and "passing" acceleration on the Burgman by making a 0.0150" spacer/shim to tighten up the torque multiplier's performance...
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Mon 22 Aug 2016, 01:14

cliffyk wrote:
[EDIT] Next project is to play with increasing the torque multiplier spring preload. I had good results improving both initial and "passing" acceleration on the Burgman by making a 0.0150" spacer/shim to tighten up the torque multiplier's performance...

So increasing the torque spring tension by adding a ~4mm thich spacer would also mean that RPMs needed to be increased to overcome that increased tension. That increased preload also resulted in increased initial and midrange/passing accelleration. Do you feel that that modification was driven because of the "24gm" sliders, and would that mod have been advantageous or necessary if only using 26gm sliders?

Won't decreasing the variator weights while increasing the torque spring tension cause the power band to shift higher up the RPM range? Does the increased spring tension "narrow" the power band vs the power band resulting from "only" switching to lower weight sliders?

Tim
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PostSubject: Re: WTB Dr Pulley Sliders   Mon 22 Aug 2016, 04:50

cliffyk wrote:
beyond what my 70 year-old, calibrated and re-calibrated for over 50 years, butt dyno tells me is the engine's peak torque band of 4500 to 5500 rpm


A rolling road dyno would probably give more accurate results Wink
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