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 Dyno test and tuning

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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 1:39

Hey there gents,

Since I installed the K&N filter, Power Commander and an after market exhaust, I'm wondering if I should tune the scoot up using a dyno machine located in a shop near by. It would run me $350, so I am not super crazy about it, but still would like to try. Anyone here have done the same? Any thoughts?

Thanks
Cheers,
Mad
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 8:03

Waste of money----enjoy SilverWing as scooter, ride it, Difficult to change old design/overweight, poor wind management. Leave alone and it can be reliable transport.
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 8:05

FWIW several early adopters of the PCIII here on the forum did have their Silverwing's set up on a dyno and were very happy with the improvement. But $350 worth of "improvement"?...I dont know. I think, maybe, they had a good relationship with those shops and got their dyno setup done at a much better price.

Tim
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Cookie
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 9:34

Hmmm... tricky one this. It does seem like quite a lot of cash.
That would buy a fair bit of fuel, coffee and pies for quite a few nice trips out.

But, hey! It's your bike and your cash - if you would find it interesting and/or useful then go for it, oh, and let us know the results please.

I think I'd buy the pies though...
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dspevack
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 16:57

When I had this done I got a 6 hp improvement and then mapped the power commander to get a much better power response.
Its only $350 once. its performance for the life of your scooter.
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Easyrider
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 20:52

I feel that since you did the changes, you should have the dyno test done. How else can you maximize the changes you did? That is my 2¢.
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Sidewinder Pilot
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 7 May - 21:46

Hey Mad, since you're obviously not in the "ride it like it came" camp, I'd say dyno it, BUT wait until you have ALL the pieces in place, I don't recall seeing if you modded your airbox. Also have you considered the HiT clutch and even possibly an after market torque spring? I don't see it mentioned often, but recall seeing one from Malossi at one time.
Get EVERTHING dialed in before dropping the cost equivalent of the mods for the tuning!
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dspevack
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sun 8 May - 19:41

Sidewinder Pilot is correct. Wait til everything is dialed in.
If its performance you want, add a J. Costa Variator. Better than Mallosi variator.
There are other performance tricks you can do, like changing the spring, or the weights, but they are minor improvements.
The Variator change is the last part of the holy trinity of Silverwing performance enhancements that you haven't done.
Trinity= Exhaust + PCommander + Variator.
Also check the link to my gallery in my sig.  It has my dyno run results in it.
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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Mon 9 May - 16:02

dspevack wrote:
Sidewinder Pilot is correct. Wait til everything is dialed in.
If its performance you want, add a J. Costa Variator. Better than Mallosi variator.
There are other performance tricks you can do, like changing the spring, or the weights, but they are minor improvements.
The Variator change is the last part of the holy trinity of Silverwing performance enhancements that you haven't done.
Trinity= Exhaust + PCommander + Variator.
Also check the link to my gallery in my sig.  It has my dyno run results in it.

Oops! I forgot to set the topic for "watch" and just realized I missed a bunch of posts. Thank you all for advise. Here is what I have so far done to my SWing performance wise:

1. K&N air filter
2. Delkevic exhaust
3. PCIII Power Commande unit
4. 26gr Dr. Pulley sliders
5. I also purchased a used air box from Ebay for dirt cheap so that I can poke holes in it if the guy at the shop tells me the bike can gain power with more air delivery. They are a pro shop and have their own team. So I tend to trust professionals like that. Still not sure, though, if I am ready to shell 3.5 Benjamins affraid

I don't know anything about the variators mod yet. I am a very new SW owner. I have the scoot only since mid March with only about 1200 miles on it since the day I purchased the bike.
I will be riding this bike mainly as a commuter; to work and back, and rarely for trips over 100 miles/day. My wife is very nervous on a bike, and I do not have time to ride on my own much. Plus the area where I live is not very pretty for riding without driving an hour away first. I used to live in Hackettstown, NJ, which is right in the foot-hills of the Appalachian mountains and man.... 5 minutes away from home and I was already on a beautiful road riding for hours a day. Not here though, not in Fairfax county, Northern Virginia, near DC. lol!
Back to the point... I like my performance for riding in traffic. More I get of it, better it is.
BTW. I love my Bluetooth setup - amp with speakers from Boss Audio. I installed an app on my phone that adjusts the sound depending on the speed using GPS of the phone and now my speakers self-adjust depending on how fast I go. Say awesome?!

Cheers,
Mad
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gremlin
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Mon 9 May - 16:27

With all the work you have done, your SW must be zooming along quite fast; I think they are a good performer even stock standard. It is nice to see that someone enjoys their scooter as much as you do!
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john grinsel
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Mon 9 May - 18:54

I think dyno testing without base reading of what your bike does/did before any mods----then step by step reading as each mod is added.....and see which add power...or do nothing.
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Greysilver
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Mon 9 May - 20:18

If you do the dyno test I would like to see the results. I think, had I done all those mods I would have to do the dyno just to measure bang for buck. So the 350$ out of pocket is written off as cost of business or a continuation of the mod train.
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The Scootist
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Wed 11 May - 11:18

Mad:
It sounds like you have really gotten into enhancing the performance of your Swing. I did the same thing after I got mine. A word of caution on the JCosta Variator - while it does contribute to a very quick acceleration, it also wears very quickly and will require replacement. I only got about 10,000 miles out of mine. Rather than replace it I switched to 22g Dr Pully Sliders which give almost the same rate of acceleration and do a better job of smoothing out the initial start up. Like Dan Spevak I put my Swing on a Dyno after installing all my mods. I ended up with about 41 hp and 40 lbs/ft of torque, but in addition, it remapped the fueling for my altitude (5280 feet above sea level) so my fuel economy was optimized. I still average in the low 50mpg range. Have fun with your Swing!
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JeffR
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Wed 11 May - 23:09

I had the J. Costa and even though it was great for added performance the pins wore out after about 9,000 miles. I'm not really sure where to buy the J. Costa or the pins anymore since scootertrap.com shut down. It also made the SWing a smoother bike and it is already a very smooth bike. I would also suggest the Dr Pulley sliders. I tried the 22 gr but later switched to the 28 gr sliders but the 22 gr will sure give you really nice acceleration. The J. Costa was $300 I believe and the pins were $65 when you need to replace them.

For your Dynajet PC, did you download the Euro map and not the U.S. map? The Euro map is much better.
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gremlin
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Thu 12 May - 16:24

I have to agree with John Grinsel: a dyno test makes no sense unless you have the before and after results. How else can you judge whether it has been successful and worth the money?
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Thu 12 May - 16:34

Well a dyno session could allow you to tweak the PCIII to get maximum performance. But Mr Grinsel is correct in that just a "test" is a moot point in the absence of before info.
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Sidewinder Pilot
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Sat 14 May - 0:14

If your goal in the dyno test is validating whether the mods, that you have already installed, and all future additions, have increased your output in a clearly measurable fashion, then the sequential testing will provide that data, at a cost!
But... If you want to make the scoot the "Ultimate Commuter", then perform all of the mods that are well know and proven. Then, when you are 100% done with the mods, you have it dyno tuned. Not just to give you a HP and Torque curve so you can say "Look how many horses I'm pushing now" , but to provide the PC with an ACCURATE custom map, for YOUR scoot in your location.
Everything you do, 22 or 24 gr sliders, an HiT clutch that is set up for your weight and CVT curve, and the airflow that is changed through the induction and exhaust mods as well as your elevation and fuel will alter the results.
(Since we have no way of modding the ignition advance curve, we have to settle for the PC, so at least your F:A is correct across the whole RPM band.)
So, unless you're into benchmarking and documentation of the modding process, for it's own sake, ...and I'm guessing that's not really what you're into, just trust that when it's done and dyno tuned it'll be the best commuter scoot it could be.
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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Wed 25 May - 16:48

JeffR wrote:
I had the J. Costa and even though it was great for added performance the pins wore out after about 9,000 miles.  I'm not really sure where to buy the J. Costa or the pins anymore since scootertrap.com shut down.  It also made the SWing a smoother bike and it is already a very smooth bike.  I would also suggest the Dr Pulley sliders.  I tried the 22 gr but later switched to the 28 gr sliders but the 22 gr will sure give you really nice acceleration.  The J. Costa was $300 I believe and the pins were $65 when you need to replace them.  

For your Dynajet PC, did you download the Euro map and not the U.S. map?  The Euro map is much better.

Thank you for your advice, Jeff. Since I have a custom exhaust I used this map: "European Model-Mivv CE Approved Slip On (db-killer installed) Stock Air Filter". I am surprised they do not offer a map for the K&N air filter, but that is the closed I can get.

Cheers,
Mad
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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Wed 25 May - 16:53

All. Thank you so much for all of your advice. What a great bunch of people!

Cheers,
Mad
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Wed 25 May - 17:17

So, Mad Man, can you please share the results of the dyno testing & tweaking. The rest of us would like to know what we're missing.

Tim
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Wed 25 May - 23:02

Mad,

I'm glad you were able to load the Euro map. The zero map used to be called the U.S. map...I think. I had that at first and then Bill (Honda Silver) told me about the Euro map. He even sent me his custom dyno'd map but it was on my old computer.
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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Thu 26 May - 9:49

Cosmic_Jumper wrote:
So, Mad Man, can you please share the results of the dyno testing & tweaking. The rest of us would like to know what we're missing.

Tim

I will. I am very close to deciding to do it. Not in a hurry though. I do know I want it, since I want to keep this ride for years to come.

Cheers,
Mad
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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Thu 26 May - 9:52

JeffR wrote:
Mad,

I'm glad you were able to load the Euro map.  The zero map used to be called the U.S. map...I think.  I had that at first and then Bill (Honda Silver) told me about the Euro map.  He even sent me his custom dyno'd map but it was on my old computer.  

I still wish they had a map for a free flowing air filter in addition to an after market exhaust. Sad

Cheers,
Mad
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Thu 26 May - 10:47

Don't they have that on the installation disc? Or you could call Dyno Jet tech support for info.
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the_mad_rshn
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PostSubject: Re: Dyno test and tuning   Thu 26 May - 14:32

Cosmic_Jumper wrote:
Don't they have that on the installation disc? Or you could call Dyno Jet tech support for info.

That map doesn't exist. I just called them and the tech was relatively helpful. He suggested how I can try to improve the performance. At least I know the direction where to go.

Cheers,
Mad
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