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 Swing won't start

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tinman
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PostSubject: Swing won't start   Sun 12 Apr 2015, 16:53

tried to boost the battery , I unknowingly cross the positive terminal with the negative side.It gave a buzzing sound ,and now there is no power to the ignition switch,and no lights. Page 19- 2 say open circuit in Black/White between the ignition coil and engine stop switch.Do I remove the right floor panel to get at the coil or do I need to look elsewhere. Electrical trouble shooting is not my cup of tea .Before I go to far help would be appreciated.
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sun 12 Apr 2015, 18:13

tinman You need to remove the left side panel, the one with the keyhole for the seat to get at the coil. After you remove the panel you'll be able to see the coil with a rubber boot over it, and at the bottom of the coil you should see a 30 amp fuse. The fuse you see is a spare. Yes need to pull the rubber boot on the coil up then you'll be able to see the fuse in the coil. If you don't have a 30 amp fuse use the spare but remember to replace it or at least carry a spare under the seat or in one of the cubbies in the dash. I hope this helps and you get your scooter running again.
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Mon 13 Apr 2015, 01:20

I did test all the fuses and they tested go. When I cross the battery cable ,a bussing came from the front  location area ,and now I turn the ignition on .there is no head light ,panel light.I will check the coil tomorrow . Chapter 19 - 2 said open circuit in Black/White wire from ignition coil and stop witch. I don't know where to look for that open circuit. I might find it hopefully by the coil.thanks for the input.
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Mon 13 Apr 2015, 11:27

Umm, aah.. While the 30amp fuse is where Roger says it is, the ignition coil is under your right foot as you are riding the scoot. Yes you need to remove the right floor skirt to get to the coil. HTH

Tim
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Mon 13 Apr 2015, 14:25

Thanks ,I checked the main relay,the engine stop relay, and fuel cut-off relay ,they show a open circuit,and should be close .there is power going to the meter at the connection .My friend works on HD MC thinks I blew out the relays when I cross the booster cables . I ordered 5 relays 2 for the low beam to make sure .  The ignition coil could be the problem,but there is no power to the key switch,there was a rattling noise before it went dead. Thanks all the suggestion help full. What do you think about the relays and can they be reset?
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Mon 13 Apr 2015, 16:07

tinman have you removed the panel with the keyhole for the seat and checked the 30 amp fuse under the rubber boot that covers the coil? I was lucky the person that sold the Silverwing I got from an auction did not check that fuse. I got a great deal because the Silverwing had no power to he key switch so mileage was unknown to the auction house. I replaced the 30 amp fuse under the rubber boot that covers the coil. It started right up and only had 51 miles on it.


Last edited by model28a on Mon 13 Apr 2015, 17:41; edited 1 time in total
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Mon 13 Apr 2015, 17:37

No I did not check the boot that covers the coil on the same side where the 3 relays are located I will look there tomorrow .Going for my yearly check up 400 kl way Wed. ,will be at it Thursday.
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Tue 14 Apr 2015, 17:53

In a similar event for me it wrecked the starter solenoid.
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DaveR
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Wed 15 Apr 2015, 18:31

I'm sure you blew the main 30 amp fuse. There is a pictoral that shows the location on this forum.
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 02:07

A friend of mine did the same thing, blew the main fuse by incorrectly connecting a jump battery to his scooter.
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 08:21

Finley back from a 13 hrs Dr's appointment ,and can concentrate on my Swing, I have to tack the front cowling off  to get at the light relays .All 3 relays are in open contact'They should be normally close,and I  suspect that the low beams relays are the same.I will remove the the front and the left lower panel to check the ignition coil,that might be fried also.Waiting for the relay switch to come in, another 150 kl trip to get them. I don't like to take to long apart  ,last time it took 2 days to remember where all the screws went. I will let you how thing went today. Thanks everyone for all your input .Mike
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 09:51

cheers bounce This morning I decided to read all of the postings,and took another look for the fuse unde the boot that Model28a  talked about ,and found under the coil all dusty and black was the spare fuse,I removed the the dust cover and found the fuse hiding under the wire connector,I immediately notice the blown fuse,installed the new fuse,my key was on the on position,and behold the fuel pump cycled the lights light up ,push the starter and voila Its alive. cheers Thanks modle28a and everyone for helping me. I have spare relays to late to return .Now there are some tabs that was broken that I will attempt to repair with epoxy,then I will clean her up and add the new fender trim to my trike . I think I will go back and start my PRECIOUS.
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 12:44

You might have better luck with ABS cement. Most of the plastic on Honda bikes is ABS. ABS cement can be purchased at most hardware stores. It comes in a small round can with a dauber under the screw top. Inexpensive. Scrape or sand off the paint that will be in the joint and glue with the cement. Let it harden for a few hours and give it another coat if needed. ABS cement will result in a chemical weld rather than a surface bond that results from JB Weld or epoxy. I've made quite a few repairs in my old shop on Goldwing plastic parts with ABS. Some pretty extensive and never had a failure of a repaired joint. I've also used the stuff to rebuild missing tabs, just make up some putty with ABS dust and cement and sculpt the tab. ABS putty is easy to make, just sand or grind up a piece of ABS pipe fitting and mix the dust with cement to a moldable consistency and apply. It will take a few days for a thick layer to cure so it will be too soft to use for awhile. If possible use several thin coats for faster curing.
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 16:16

exavid as odd as it may sound I've looked for ABS cement and all I could find was cement for ABS and PVC. I believe I've read that they are different, it may have been from one of your older posts. But I did find out that the cement I found didn't work very well. We used to have lots of different hardware stores around but since Home Depot and Lowes came to town all the others have closed down. Evil or Very Mad
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Cosmic_Jumper
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 22:30

That ABS plumbing cement is made by Oatey. It's probably available on-line. Be sure that you get ABS-only cement, not ABS/PVC or PVC cement. Don't get anything but a small can though because the liquid tends to evaporate over time once the can has been opened. Maybe if you wrap the can lid thread with teflon tape it will make the lid air tight.

You can also try Klean Strip liquid paint stripper. It has a high content of methylene chloride which is probably what that ABS cement contains. You'll need to be very careful with that Kleer Strip stuff, it will probably dissolve ABS if it's dosed too heavily.

A Hobby supply store might also have some ABS specific cement too. HTH

Tim
Edit: Corrected Product name


Last edited by Cosmic_Jumper on Sat 18 Apr 2015, 21:29; edited 1 time in total
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Thu 16 Apr 2015, 23:44

I finally have it all together ,the tabs that broke off were a spacer with a hole through it to keep the black inside screwed to the front cowl ( batwing) together. Tomorrow it's a good washing then the fender trim,and a shine,check the tire pressure . O yea I had only one screw that need to find it's place.LOL.
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Fri 17 Apr 2015, 00:21

Oatey as the man said. Here's a link to get a look at the can. It comes in various sizes the small four ounce can is only a couple dollars or in your case a couple of loonies.

http://www.oatey.com/products/plastic-pipe-cements-and-primers/oatey-abs-cements/abs-medium-black-cement
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sat 18 Apr 2015, 18:38

Reading starter relay switch. Service manual page 20-11,there is no information about a spare fuse or that there is one under the rubber boot.It was only when I removed the connector that I could see one 30 amp fuse hiding under the connector.I would never have found it had I had not taken a second look at Modle 28a posting .This Honda service manual is not as detail as the Shop,service manual that my 85 750 Shadow . Thanks for every thing.The Honda dealer charge a 20% restocking fee of $12.00.Im OK with that.
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exavid
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sat 18 Apr 2015, 19:06

In the owner's manual for the 2002 model there's a diagram and paragraph about the main fuse.
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Mike from NS
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sat 18 Apr 2015, 21:02

On the tabs rebuild... either somewhere on this site or something stumbled upon elsewhere ... but the recommendation was to use black tie wraps with with heat from a soldering gun to melt the tie wrap and "weld" it to the area where a missing tab needs to be built up. The black tie wraps are supposed to be abs plastic. Haven't tried it but for whatever it may be worth, I offer this here. It may have been on a youtube video, where I saw this. Might be worth some practice before trying on the bike.

It is amazing the wealth of information on this site .... I think I'll get a look for that 30 amp fuse some day soon.
Mike
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sun 19 Apr 2015, 18:41

After replacing the 30 amp fuse, I notice the my Oxford heater was not working along with myShark audio system and the 12 Volt plugin .I tested the Oxford fuse for some continuity,it tested positive but no power to the grips. I met a few biker friends they had a look at the fuse again and notice a hair line crack in the 5 amp fuse. I could not see it with my glass's on .a replacement was given to me and there is power to the grips.I could not see that the fuse was blown .It's nice to have friends that can see better then me.
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sun 19 Apr 2015, 19:42

tinman I understand that kind of problem. I've had to swap fuses with a known good fuse until I figured out which fuse was bad. Getting old ain't for sissies, and they call them the golden years. Rolling Eyes
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Swing won't start   Sun 19 Apr 2015, 20:15

It made a big difference with the heat grips on .7 C., My leather winter  mitt's ,a pair of long John,s denim jeans,wind pants, t shirt,sweater hoody First gear linner jacket and my leather jacket ,face shield ,did 200 kl ,and warm as toast.
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