Need advice on buying Silverwing or Burgman 650

Hey all!  I am new here, been riding two wheeler's  since 1951, have ridden Harley, Honda, Suzuki, not a real accomplished rider, but dedicated!  My last real bike was a 89 PC800, rode it a lot, finally quit riding any distance -could not get off when stopped, had to kinda roll off, old 70 year old body just stiffened up. But lo and behold -- the Burgman 400 - my current ride.  But it is not big enough - I want to move up to a Silver  Wing or a Burgman 650, want to take a good ride this spring, leave Houston and head north - hope to get to Mount Rushmore, go until the money runs out!  

I am 77, in good health, reflexes still good, started riding on Cushmans -just like to ride.

I like the 650, but am a little bit worried about repairs, seems like that power shift transmission is just a problem waiting to happen.. I have had three Honda's  - a Gold Wing, a PC800, and a Magnum V65, all were really good bikes, the V65 was a real blast to ride, took it to Tennessee and a couple of other nice rides.

Like everyone else, my money is limited, but I have found a low mileage Silver Wing here in Houston - 2008 and I am wondering -- Silver Wing or Suzuki -- any advice would be appreciated!

Welcome to the forum.

I have had a Suzuki Burgman 400, two Silverwings and a few Helix's. I prefer the Silverwing. Plenty of under seat storage. Honda reliability and Honda dealerships are everywhere.

Good luck with your choice.

Search the forum for the word Burgman and you'll find a lot of comparisons, especially by John Grinsel who has spent a lot of time on both.

Dan

I doubt if you can go wrong with either. The Burgie 400 is actually imho, more similar to the Silver Wing then to its larger sibling. I have a friend with the 400 and it seems to me that it should say Honda on it... LOL The 650 has more options available but at quite a bit more dosh ($). It is also bigger and heavier. If you like the 400 but want a bit more power than snag a used Silver Wing. If you want more features (options) then get a new Burgman 650.

This is after all, a Silver Wing forum so will tend to be biased... I am sure there are Burgie forums so you can hear their side of the story! Good luck.

Having had both new SilverWing 600 and Burgman 400 = two, first one turned back to dealer as engine out 3 times with oil leak---Present Burgman 400 2011 ABS bought new as leftover on promo deal-- now 34,000 miles, at 20,000 still on warranty Suzuki paid for complete pulley replacement, clutch, rollers/sliders, outer bearing on rear clutch had failed and spun,at that time, time for belt change I had spare on on it went.

SilverWing at that milage only required new Belt.

Will be 75 in May---consideration for me is how easy bike goes up on lift---Burgman400 or SilverWing ok, My NT 700V could be handful---as I was thinking about all the expensive plastic I could break if I dropped bike!

I have ridden Burgman 650----but $11,000 and 613 lbs weight=not attractive----good features of 650 are electric windshield and somewhat easier rear wheel removal. BUT transmission problems don't scare me......most trouble seems to come from used machines with unknown maint. and riding history.....and then owner wants Suzuki to fix free.

SilverWing is no longer current model in US----2012-2013 new left overs can be had for $7800 in Chattanooga, all ABS Which I feel is 100% necessary. SilverWing weight around 541 lbs.

Why something bigger----displacement or physical size??----probably Burgman 400 measures a few inches bigger than SilverWing, and weighs 489-----both run up to 90mph easily when you are trying to keep from getting run over.

Handling I believe SilverWing ridden as scooter is much better than Burgman 400 and probably better than the 650. Solid mount engine and not so much rear weight bias.

Last----having purchased 10 new Maxi-scooters since 1990 and ridden now over 300,000 miles with them-----all have severe BUFFETING PROBLEM. my book=uncomfortable in the long haul
Only SilverWing with GIVI adjustable shield works period. I have wasted lots of $$ on after market shields trying to overcome basic design problem of the Maxi scooters......your nose is too far from tip of shield. My baseline for good buffeting control Heinrich equipped BMW in the past, current NT700V Honda stock , scooter=Vespa with the right look over shield.

March April is my decision time for new bike----Another SilverWing looking strong for me??
March April

Honda Forza @ $6000 ABS, interesting ,too

   ezrider.  If you have found a low mileage 2008 and can get it at a good price, I would give it a good look. (You can learn more about buying used by typing "buying used" into the search box in the upper left corner.) If it has ABS, it is probably very close to any of the models that followed. Good luck with your search and your trips.    

ezrider,

Do you know about the www.burgmanusa.com site? I would look into the year of the B650 and how it was serviced. Everyone says they are much heavier and have a little more power but the SWing gets up and down the mountains here in California with no problem 2 up for us. If I were to ever buy the B650 I would make sure I also bought the 5 year protection plan just in case the ECVT went out. They say it is about $3,000 to fix, unless you can do it yourself.

I have had no trouble with the SWing and like John Grinsel said, the Airflow is the best screen IMO. I have had the stock, Standard Givi, XL Clearview with vent (it bent back bad at 80mph), and now have the Airflow and it is the best of the bunch for me. If you ask on the Burgman site they will basically trash the SWing but it is probably the most dependable scoot there is and is very comfortable on the interstate. They say the B650 is a tad bit smoother but the SWing is very smooth for me at 80mph and it will do that all day.

But good luck with what you get and if you get the B650 make sure you change the 'stopper bolt' as i hear that is thought to the be the big reason the ECVT could go out. But ask on the burgmanusa site about that.

hi Gadget here in the U K I had a Burgman 400 ,but chopped it part ex
for a silver wing 600, the back pain went, the wing so cumfie , so smoth
due to twin cylinders. as you work on it the quality is obvious .
i can confirm 80 mph 2 up with a weeks gear on board is no problem
still 2000 revs to spare for a over take[ on the autoban ]
it will do 60mpg to a U K gallon At 150 miles there a 2 bars left on fuel gage
and at gas station this about 3.5 lt left in the tank.
I find I can ride for several hours at a time, any bike I have had in my later years
has been 2 hr and then a break, so is good for long trips.
go for Honda and enjoy

I've had two Silverwings and one Burgman 650. Both are excellent scooters. The Burgman is definitely smoother especially when you open the throttle. I like the ignition key opening of the seat storage too. The Burgman 650 can carry two heavier riders than the Silverwing if you go by the GWV ratings of both as shown in the specs. I do find the Silverwing a bit more nimble but just a bit. The Silverwing is a lot easier to work on. Maintenance of the Silverwing is easier because you don't have to remove any plastic to change the oil. The Burgman requires a panel to be removed to change oil but does have a sight glass for oil level.

It's a difficult choice I like 'em both. Due to the possibility of a transmission problem I'd give the nod to the Silverwing especially if I was buying a bike out of warranty. If it were a higher mileage scooter I'd definitely choose the Silverwing because of it's reliability and long life with few problems. If both bikes were new it would be a coin toss for me.

I'd go with the Silverwing...or look to something like the Honda CTX700 which is also low to the ground.

I did some research on 650 CVT failures one evening, and if you'd like the spreadsheet I compiled, just send me a PM with a private email address.  The problem with the data is we don't know how many 650s didn't have a problem...only those who reported one on BurgmanUSA.  So I'll admit the data is suspect.  What I found out of those that failed, was the 2003 and 2004 650s that failed, only had about 17-19,000 miles on them.  Later years about doubled that mileage.  With many riders not putting on more than a couple thousand miles a year, they'll probably have no problems.

Interestingly, someone this morning reported their 650 died.  They had put on 10,000 miles on a used 650.  I think their mileage was around 40K now.

The Burgman 650 is a wonderful bike for someone who likes them.  But the $3000-3500 cost of repair if the CVT goes out would put me off.  I'd take the far simpler Silverwing hands down and be able to ride without question if you took a trip out of the local area.

BTW, you'll read comments from members at BurgmanUSA saying to go ahead and buy a 650, that there are no problems and the CVT issue is blown out of proportion.  But those same members never seem to post in the threads where a CVT has died.

Chris

I agree about the CVT worry with the Burgman650 but it does seem they might have that worked out in the latest model years when they changed the system a bit to improve gas mileage an advertised 15%. Not to sound disloyal because I'm a long time owner of Honda products and have ridden GWs for over 200,00 miles but if it weren't for the CVT problem the Burgman 650 would, to me, be a superior scooter to the Silverwing. It's past time for Honda to update the Silverwing.

Agreed.  I never liked the looks of the older model 650, but that would never stop me from recommending it to anyone.  Looks are just a personal bias each of us have.  The CVT issue would.  It would be nice if the modifications to the CVT would help.  If I remember right, MJR (one of the experts) said he didn't think the changes would make a difference.  Only time (and miles) will tell.

In the meantime, I'll keep riding my NT700V and hopefully by the time I go back to scooters, this will all be worked out.  

Chris

Indeed, I'll keep trucking on my Goldwing for now with an eye out for another SW or what ever maxi scooter catches my eye.

exavid wrote:

Indeed, I'll keep trucking on my Goldwing for now with an eye out for another SW or what ever maxi scooter catches my eye.

Hey man, I have both! My wife says I can keep both IF I can figure out how to pay for them...   
So far so good! I hate to get rid of the SW as I truly LIKE it and since I bought it new I KNOW its history from Mile 1 to present! The GW is great, what with cruise control and self cancelling turn signals (two things the SW should have). And as smooth as my SW is the GW GL1800 is in a class by itself. And the power? WOW!

But all said I like both for their individual differences. Will keep you all posted.

I agree with exavid that the SWing needs to be updated, and I don't mean the update they did with the new Swing in Europe. I would like a 700 cc engine with larger wheels and a bit better suspension. I don't need the fancy transmission and things. But I guess that is what the new Honda Integra is supposed to be, larger wheels, bigger engine and suspension. But I hear it is cramped to sit in though but reports overseas says it is the best handling scooter in the curves. So if it came here I may look at it but one day will probably get the new honda 750cc with the DCT.

I would have kept my last SW but garage space and four other vehicles made it overly expensive. Too many insurance policies. I expect one of these days though I'll get another scooter, they're just too handy around town not to.

I don't know why the Honda Integra is called a scooter. Other than slightly smaller wheels than a motorcycle it really looks like a bike. There really isn't even a nominal 'step through' frame on the machine. I doubt it would do well in the US though some folks who don't want to be on a scooter might buy one and think it looks enough like a 'real motorcycle' to salve their egos. I think most in this country who'd look at the Integra would probably go for the CTX or NCX 700. They are very similar to the Integra and indisputably 'motorcycles'. Probably pretty comparable in price too.

I believe the only reason the Integra is sold as a "scooter" in Europe, is because Honda wants to market the bike in that market. All those arguments about engine placement, wheels, step through, etc. that we make about whether our bikes are "scooters" or "motorcycles"...just got thrown out the window by Honda.     

I looked at it closely when it first came out. Under the plastic bodywork, it is the same as an NC700X or NC700S. Same size tires. Same engine. Same frame. Same suspension as the NC700S with only a minor change from the NC700X for suspension travel.

I'd love it, if Honda sold it in the USA.

Chris

I'd like a chance to test ride one of those new 700s. I'd like to see how well they'd handle the freeway. The SW did fine I'll bet those would too. The time's coming before too long before I'm going to need to give up the big Wing for something lighter.

In this comparison of Burgman 650/SilerWing and maybe Burgman 400....all are kind of overweight. And then there is the price spread---current US round numbers, Burgman 650 $11,000, Left over SilverWings @ $8,000, Burgman 400 current about $8,000 ABS (maybe a little expensive),

SilverWing makes most $$ sense.

Again my feeling on the Burgman 650 driveline complaints---probably trouble free bought new and not diddled with----old junk you take your chances.....they sad thing is they cost a lot to fix. Buying a new on I figure I would get 50,000 trouble free miles and then trade.

Much of the new Honda pretend scooters have open chain and no centerstand---not fun if you take care of chains.

In the u.k. the swing was at the motorcycle show in November ,so I guess a new one is still up for grabs here at present .