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 Honda requires urgent shipment of grease

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Dave Weller
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PostSubject: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:06 pm

My scooter is now a year old, so I decided to do a self service.
I've noted that it was put together 'dry'.
No sign of any grease on wheel spindles, brake shims or anything else, all the exhaust mounting bolts were dry.
Hopefully the next service will be easy, and my additional greasing/protection will keep the salt corrosion at bay.

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RArch
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:00 pm

Yes, I can confirm the very same with mine and a friends. Recently we had new tyres fitted and removed the wheels ourselves everything that should have been greased needed some.

Doesn't it feel good that you know its all been done Smile
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DickO
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:15 pm

Hi All,
I've not been in the manual for quite some time now 'cuz I just haven't done any maintenance lately or needed to. Still, what maintenance I 'have' done required no "greasing". Are there many items (nuts, bolts, etc) that require greasing? Even if there are some, when you get the job done, there shouldn't be excess grease all over the parts. So, just because you didn't see any grease (or any other lubricant) doesn't mean it wasn't applied; only that someone (factory assemblers or a good mechanic) properly followed good (or required) maintenance procedures and cleaned up as necessary.
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model28a
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:50 pm

Just from memory I know you need to put a very a little grease on the spline of the axle, if it rusts you will have a heck of a time removing the rim.
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RArch
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:48 pm

Yeah, the axle and dust seals in the wheels (after cleaning) require some grease. The rear axle has a shallow 3mm grove which should be filled with grease.

When I fitted new brake pads, the backs and sliding points where lightly coated with copper grease. The pistons once cleaned with a toothbrush where also given a light coating which hopefully will make them easier to clean next time. I didn't touch the seals on the sliders but you should use red rubber grease on them as other greases may cause them to swell.
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tinman
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:04 pm

The clutch bell bearing gets dry and will squeal when dry.
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bikerboy
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:00 am

When I had my rear wheel out I used some Rocol ASP moly compound left over from my ST1100 days on the splines. It's not mentioned in the manual but I don't think it will harm and might prevent problems. I always smear axles with grease befors replacing them.
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Dave Weller
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:59 am

I always have 3 pots of different grease to apply to anything that moves on the bike, a black moly grease is one of them left over from my Pan-European days, the first thing that usually seizes up on bikes is the centre stand shaft, I have grease spray cans for that.
I don't use copper slip grease on anything other than the brake parts and hot exhaust bolts, as it tends to dry and become hard over time.
I use LM (high melting point) grease for wheel bearings, at the time of a service, I force fresh grease past the seals, if nothing else it waterproofs them.
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SCTLVR
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:47 pm

Ditto, nighthawk250.
Assembly lube on fasteners makes future service much easier.
Don't forget to use a torque wrench and go by the Service Manual's spec's.
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bikerboy
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:48 pm

Please, what is assembly lube ? I was taught never to use a torque wrench on lubed components.
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Dave Weller
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 5:41 pm

You was taught well bikerboy, never use a torque wrench on lubed components, I only use a torque wrench, if I'm likely to strip a thread, eg sump plug thread, and do expensive damage.
Assembly lube= grease.
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rollsroyce250
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:44 pm

nighthawk250 wrote:

Assembly lube= grease.

Assembly lube= heavy motor oil fortified with moly to reduce initial pressure damage. The moly coats the interfering surfaces so they don't gall or seize.
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DickO
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 7:21 pm

nighthawk250 wrote:
You was taught well bikerboy, never use a torque wrench on lubed components,

That's an interesting concept. Does it apply only to motorcycles? I'm asking out of curiosity only because as an aircraft engine technician, we had torque applications for both "dry" (unlubricated) and "wet" (lubricated) torque on nuts, bolts, etc, applied as dictated in the tech manual.

I had personally just never heard of it being inappropriate to apply torque wrenches to lubricated parts. So, how would you properly 'tighten' a lubricated fastener/assembly if there is no specification??
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jmaslak
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:32 pm

The variator bolt must be lubricated and torqued with a torque wrench. Other bolts have dry specs listed. But lubing a bolt where that isn't necessary and torquing to dry specs will cause you to over torque it.

FWIW, I haven't seen any hard to remove bolts even on a six year old Swing.
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bikerboy
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:39 am

I've never had to torque anything that had a 'wet' specification but if that's what the book says I would have done it. Being an amateur I tend to go by the book altho' I used have a lot of prompting from my late father in law who serviced the Merlin engines in WW11 !!
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tarmacburner2
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:37 am

bikerboy wrote:
my late father in law who serviced the Merlin engines in WW11 !!

What all of them Question Did they give him a petrol ration or did he have to use a treader?

What a loveley sound that engine makes, especially when four of them are on a Lancaster.

Cheers,
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Colin B
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:15 am

I once encountered a Rolls Royce (car) into which the owner had fitter a Merlin engine, under an extended bonnet. It sounded wonderful.

I've seen many a stretched limo, but none quite like that.

Rolls Royce disowned it! Evil or Very Mad
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Dave Weller
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:54 am

I know the car. Rolls objected to the radiator and flying lady IIRC,
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Colin B
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:49 am

I think they saw it as a travesty and weren't prepared to support it, or acknowledge it as one of theirs.

How do you know of it?

I saw it when it was brought to the (late, lamented) Television Centre for inclusion on a programme.
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SCTLVR
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:12 am

Yes, assembly lube with moly and do torque the bolts, according to research and articles in Racecar Engineering and Race Tech. Without lubrication, actual torque can be well below the necessary stress required to securely bind threads together because of additional "drag" induced by oxidized threads.
To be certain that a fastener is properly tightened there is only one true method: bolt stretch with clean dry/lubed threads. Second choice with used threads is chase the threads with a tap, lube and torque. Lube also allows for easy future removal.
"Opinions" vary, of course, that's why they're called opinions. Even fastener experts are not in complete agreement on lubricating threads...
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Dave Weller
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:32 pm

Colin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolls-Royce_Merlin_alternative_uses

I used to drink in the Dukes Head nr. Epsom in the 60's, the editor of Custom Car Magazine was also a customer, who got a few of my mechanic friends in the motor trade, interested in custom cars, one of which was getting Beast on the road, They were always working on projects for the magazine and Santa Pod.
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Colin B
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:11 pm

Probably the same one - how many could there be?

I saw it in the early 70's and it was presented as a genuine, modified, Roller. Apart from the stretch, it looked the business.

My ailing memory says it was brought in to appear on the "Record Breakers" programme, which fits with the link.


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RArch
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PostSubject: Re: Honda requires urgent shipment of grease   Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:43 pm

To get us back on topic this I'm sure needed some grease Wink

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